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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
 Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 01:45:49
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Sista
Gambia's problem is not Person A or B. The new president, or new coup leader or the rebel will not change anything in a day. The problem is not about personalities. The problem is about literacy level, teacher per students, doctor per patients, gdp per capita, the court not having fax machine that works are the problem.
Do they think the coruption will disappear in one day while poor civil servant has a salary that pays his family's monthly rice? There may be better president, but the difference won't be significant.
Besides, there are many people I know they support the president with passion. He has legimate support. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 01:53:32
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http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/LDE6281H0.htm
P.S. This is a news article. It is not claimed to be an 'overwhelming' evidence of 'innocence' or 'guilt'. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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shaka
996 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 01:59:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Sister Omega
Now I understand that many people choose to remain annoymous that's fine and of course I'm fully aware about what bantaba is all about and its tendancy to draw out a subjects and go out on tangents etc. Yes, I agree with you that we all have a right to our opinions, and to agree, diagree, agreeing to differ and refraining to comment altogether. Karamba's thread as Turk rightly said is " subjective " to say the least and all of us here are fully aware about his stance on the ARPC government. However at least he could talk about policy rather than personality after all that's what politics is about. On the other hand he wishes to continually assasinate other peoples character but is to afraid to reveal his own face. That in my mind is a mark of a coward full of bravado and no substance.
Peace
Sister Omega
Just forget about Karamba's face and perceived cowardice, you might just have a debate with him. Otherwise, you too will be 'politicking about personalities(Karamba's in this case)' |
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 19:30:31
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Turk I'm fully aware and have no doubt that the Presdident has legimate support we can see that from the polls. And yes, I'm totally aware of the fact that Gambia's first enemy is poverty and all the other barriers that co-exist with it.
Shaka do you have the gift of sight for I'm yet to receive a grande Bubu from the Sheikh. However the beautiful Grand Bubu I was wearing was my wedding dress. Glitz and glamour are one thing however for me beauty lies in the eyes of th beholder. Shaka I also agree with you about dessiminating information and not being taken in by the illusions created in cyberspace. Don't get me wrong I do like beautiful things however I'm more interested in the qualities of someone's character than his or her wealth.
Poltricking is the volley ball of politics, personality clashes and trying to win points over opponents is all part and parcel of the game. However there are individuals who do take what we write on here very seriously on the ground enough to literally put them into practice whether they are negative or positive, and I think we all have a responsibility to acknowledge that fact. As well as the possible adverse impacts that may effect our families, friends and communities on the ground. The greatest strength of Gambia is its social cohesion that must not be compromised. Divergent views are one thing incitement towards violence is entirely different thing altogether.
The bantaba's format fulfills a niche in itself and it is quite different from facebook and there is plenty of room for both styles of platforms on the web.
Long Live The Gambia and Long Live the Bantaba.
Peace
Sister Omega
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Peace
Sister Omega |
Edited by - Sister Omega on 15 Mar 2010 19:37:30 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 20:43:03
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"Incitement to violence, legal limitations, subjective, confusion, lack of political boundaries, mass support for president": (Sister Omega + Turk + Omega + Turk + - + -)
Interesting equation!
Starting with you Sister Omega, where in any of my postings have I demonstrated incitement of violence? From what I can see, it is you who wants to incite violence reaction from the audience of this noble Bantaba against my posts. You have knocked, knocked, and knocked without success. My position on Yaya Jammeh is simple and clear. He knows what he is doing and how much wrong. Yet he insists doing so for selfish motivation. Can you give one good reason why Gambia of this age and time need to keep Yaya Jammeh as head of state even for one more day? How much insult are you heaping on so many able Gambians?
Your assumption of my political motives, I can only say they are seriously wrong. I have no political interest or need political position what ever it is. I am happy with what I have to do and doing so satisfactorily.
Should it take only those interested in politics to challenge what goes wrong? At your level of exposure and standard of awareness, one only expects you will want to share diverse concerns. There are stakes and each of us remain stakeholders.
Yaya Jammeh is simply not the best human on planet Earth to earn the infallibility of serving a country like Gambia this long. His reason (one big reason) for toppling the previous government levelled against the concern for overstay in power. If it was wrong that time, why not now? That is exactly where the evidence of unfairness and subjectivity manisfest in Yaya Jammeh. That is called deception by all standards. What is so special about Yaya that when he is gone nobody in Gambia is able to perform?
Turk, for you, I find your dictatorial advances so scary. Look at what you wrote:
"Karamba
I am convinced our debate is not going anywhere. Let us agree on disagreement. However."
Then you went ahead:
"Sista
Gambia's problem is not Person A or B. The new president, or new coup leader or the rebel will not change anything in a day. The problem is not about personalities. The problem is about literacy level, teacher per students, doctor per patients, gdp per capita, the court not having fax machine that works are the problem.
Do they think the coruption will disappear in one day while poor civil servant has a salary that pays his family's monthly rice? There may be better president, but the difference won't be significant."
Clearly, two elements harbour in that cell. One is dictatorship, the other is bigotry. How did you reach the conclusion about Gambia as though projecting a jungle territory untouched by modernisation at all?
You have right to your opinion and that is the highest personal authority you can bank on. Others have similar authority. You go on to do, write or say what consoles you. That has no bearing on what or how another person feels or does.
To the two of you, in your belief that Yaya Jammeh commands 'overwhelming' political support to the point of sweeping every occasion of polls, why are you bothered about little people with little influence in snatching that mass support?
Sister Omega, Shaka got it right again by pointing to your pursuit of digging the face of Karamba for army chief Yaya to see. What do you say to that?
Is Gambian president Yaya Jammeh in drug dealings?
Those of you who seek to defend Yaya Jammeh, be very careful for he is well known in surprises. That includes surprising his dead supporters. There is overwhelming evidence for that. Yaya enjoys playing surprise, surprise, surprise!
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Karamba |
Edited by - Karamba on 15 Mar 2010 20:58:07 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 21:24:48
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quote:
Clearly, two elements harbour in that cell. One is dictatorship, the other is bigotry. How did you reach the conclusion about Gambia as though projecting a jungle territory untouched by modernisation at all?
I said legit support. "overwhelming" is your word that desribes the non-existed evindence in this case. Not mine.
Come again? Bigotry? Projecting a jungle territory? Untouched by modernization? What are you mumbling? You don't make sense at all. There are people who are making critics on the president of Gambia. Legit critics! You on the other hand obsessed with this man. Your hate, emotions go beyond your logic and disabling your intellectual ability to make sense when you make critics. Tell me something that makes sense. Write something makes sense Karamba, so I can debate. Tell me what overwhelming evidence is.
Stop the dirty politics. Stop the smear campaign. Stop lynching mentality. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 15 Mar 2010 21:35:59 |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 21:51:52
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quote:
Originally posted by turk
Karamba
I am convinced our debate is not going anywhere. Let us agree on disagreement. However.
There is a roadmap for you if you want to change things in Gambia within the political framework. There is an election coming and win the election. The process is clear. You need to win the election. Than change the legal process. It may be a long shot, but there is no other way. Deal with the reality. I understand your frustration but the changes must be done within political framework exist in Gambia. I hope you are not suggesting another coup or uprising which would be the worse thing for Gambia.
The political situation (rampant atrocities, arbitary arrests, detentions, abductions, disappearances, maiming of the judiciary & extra-judicial killings) invite worse thing for Gambia
I don't think there will be another election to allow Jammeh to stay longer Therefore worse option is in the cards as ACE TO ARREST THE SITUATION. How can a full army (The PRESIDENT'S MEN; from Generals, Inspector General of Police, Army Commanders, Lts, Captains, Cadets, soldiers at all levels & other law enforcement agents) languish in jail
Trust me Jammeh is not sleeping well! His coup is o.k but for other patriots its not o.k
It goes like this; "WHAT IS GOOD FOR THE GOOSE IS GOOD FOR THE GANDER!" |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 21:59:54
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Very unfortunately Turk, I can't attempt "making sense" for you. That is your exclusive powers to do. That is sitting deep inside you. Nobody else can reach out that far to "make sense" for you. I can understand when you get to hate what you see from my posts. It is wonderful that you can make some sense out of what comes up to the extent of disliking it but the producer does still not convey sense.
That to be is an amount of disturbing contradictions. Say you dislike what you see. Believe it or not that's not for you then. All that you see about Yaya Jammeh is for him. |
Karamba |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 22:24:26
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Let me try again.
quote:
Clearly, two elements harbour in that cell. One is dictatorship, the other is bigotry. How did you reach the conclusion about Gambia as though projecting a jungle territory untouched by modernisation at all?
and
quote:
Gambia's problem is not Person A or B. The new president, or new coup leader or the rebel will not change anything in a day. The problem is not about personalities. The problem is about literacy level, teacher per students, doctor per patients, gdp per capita, the court not having fax machine that works are the problem.
Do they think the coruption will disappear in one day while poor civil servant has a salary that pays his family's monthly rice? There may be better president, but the difference won't be significant."
My quote and your respond does not make any sense to me. Like I said. Come again.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 22:35:41
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Turk, making sense is your task. If nothing makes sense to you, that is absolutely unhelpful from this narrow end.
Chemists, when they prefer a given colour, they often end up producing what looks like it. That is what manipulation permits.
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Karamba |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 23:41:12
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Karamba
What I said was obvious. Gambia has socio-economic problems. It is what it is. Gambia is the one of the 20-30 poorest country in the world. Very low HDI! This is the reality of Gambia. That is the priority of Gambia. The Gambians on the street have different priorities than you. But, dirty politics, smear campaign, demonization and character assassination became your habit. When you mention:
“How I reach conclusion that Gambia is a jungle and untouched by modernization”, you are motivated by character assassination. You are implying that I am insulting Gambia. How low can you go?
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2010 : 23:45:42
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Karamba stop getting so paranoid. If you feel more comfortable with your avatar representing you then stick with it. After all as Shaka clearly stated that this isn't facebook there's no reason for you to show your face unless you want too. So feel free for JFK to keep on representing you after all that's your choice. I just merely suggested it because your celebrity status on the bantaba is some what intriguing to say the least. If you pardon the pun. On the other hand Yaya Jammeh doesn't need to hide himself behind JFK to say what he means and mean what he saysbut then that's the difference between a leader and a wannanbe.
Peace
Sister Omega |
Peace
Sister Omega |
Edited by - Sister Omega on 15 Mar 2010 23:50:11 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 16 Mar 2010 : 00:06:33
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quote:
Originally posted by turk
Karamba
What I said was obvious. Gambia has socio-economic problems. It is what it is. Gambia is the one of the 20-30 poorest country in the world. Very low HDI! This is the reality of Gambia. That is the priority of Gambia. The Gambians on the street have different priorities than you. But, dirty politics, smear campaign, demonization and character assassination became your habit. When you mention:
“How I reach conclusion that Gambia is a jungle and untouched by modernization”, you are motivated by character assassination. You are implying that I am insulting Gambia. How low can you go?
Very poor country yet hosting the richest president! Are you still struggling to make sense of any cards on the table?
By the way, I have no objection about Gambian poverty. What I don't blend well is the scale of poverty you are now parading against the back drop a filthy rich president deserving all your energy and finger muscles to defend by hook or by crook.
“When Jammeh took power, he was earning less than $300 a month. Today, he is claiming to be one of the richest people in Africa. He was so poor that he was extremely malnourished when he came to power. Today he is living an extravagant lifestyle at the expense of the Gambian people,” said Jow.
These are the people Turk, that you believe don't bother who is deepening their hardship.
Check this one:
http://www.newstimeafrica.com/archives/1051
Sister Omega, no worries. I know you are about leg pulling. Greater respects! |
Karamba |
Edited by - Karamba on 16 Mar 2010 00:15:05 |
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 16 Mar 2010 : 00:50:19
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Karamba you need to go and see Gambia for yourself and do your own research because the image you are portraying about Gambia is completely different from what is on the ground. You forget to mention the emergence of the middle class in your analyse many who've returened from the west and craved out a living in the country. Yes there's poverty we're not disputinng that but the wealth distribution is higher than it was in previous decades. Gambia in the early 90's was the in the bottom ten of the poorest countries in the world. today it's ranked 149 Gambia, The $1.300 GDP per Capita in 2009 http://www.photius.com/rankings/economy/gdp_per_capita_2009_1.html
By Economic freedom Gambia is ranked 118 http://www.heritage.org/Index/Ranking.aspx
Peace
Sister Omega
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Peace
Sister Omega |
Edited by - Sister Omega on 16 Mar 2010 01:05:11 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 16 Mar 2010 : 01:07:48
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Sister Omega,
The matter regarding poverty in Gambia is an issue picked by our able Turk and I have no reason to refute his claims. I only asked how he got the stats and he was reluctant.
Wealth distribution. Did I get that clear. Proportional distribution, uneven distribution, which way are we going?
In proportion to his supposed legitimate income from what the job of Gambian President pays, something else is backing Chairman Jammeh's abundant wealth different from his income. Jesus, as they call who was Inspector General of Gambia Police for 18 months saved GD8 Million. Is that the type of income distribution you are about Sister Omega. Remember it was Chairman Jammeh who declared transparency and accountability. From what Kobo recently oberved, it does not seem these values and claims now exist for good use.
Is it right that we see our president rich and could not ask where he is getting all the wealth from. Even if demons at the back yard Kanilai forest had donated our president, we want to know. Remember Jammeh several times claimed deriving his money wealth from "Allah's World Bank" (God forbid!)
I thought as president, chairman should be more open. He was not in business before and did not have all the farms as he does now.
Seriously there are issues demanding attention and Turk will stand very unfair to call anyone names just by mere questions.
Still not clear, may be someone able to put it simpler and more whatever can help. |
Karamba |
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