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anna
Netherlands
730 Posts |
 Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 12:04:52
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I suggest we are none of us going to jump over any cliffs........
You are a bad loser Mansasula, and a bad 'listener' - i was only trying to explain the origin of the WORD 'homosexual' to you and you can go into any library and find out that i am right in my explanation. For the rest: i thought we already came to the conclusion that our perceptions of homosexuality differ so greatly that we will never manage to meet in the middle. Your loss!
I am not speaking let alone thinking for Kayatta, the man can speak and think for himself convincingly.
Sorry Kay, to have gotten you mixed up in this childish 'debate'. |
When an old African dies, it is as if a whole library has burnt down.
Amadou Hampate Ba (Mali) |
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fee_sweetie
United Kingdom
127 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 15:38:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Prince
Why do they keep on releasing these people into our communities ??
I think Prince was referring to the certain Closed Minded, Barbaric, Shallow, Discriminating, Backward thinking people of Bantaba.
Hats off to you Anna, I think its all fallen on deaf ears but you gave it your best shot. Your posts where strong, intelligent and spoken by a woman that lives in the 21ST CENTURY and doesn't judge a person by their Race, Religion or Sexuality.
I think people that agreed with the actions of these ludicrous pathetic people are disgusting and I hope for the sake of their family they're dead bodies are never mistreated in this way. |
"Religion is an insult to human dignity. Without it you'd have good people doing good things + evil people doing evil things but for good people to do evil things it takes religion"- Richard Dawkins |
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tamsier
United Kingdom
558 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 15:53:55
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| Isn’t it sad that people are more interested in demonizing gay people when there are more dangerous things happening to this world [e.g. murders, paedophiles, rapists, terrorists etc]. If anyone condones disinterring a death body in such a fashion regardless of the deceased’s lifestyle before death really needs to look deep inside themselves. The arrogance of certain people to pass judgment as to who is normal and who is not, is beyond my comprehension. It is normal for gay people to sleep with the same sex just as it is normal for heterosexual people to sleep with the opposite sex. If it is normal to them, it is normal to them and as long as the gay community are not affecting the way you live your life, you should shut up and mind your own business. Straight people who advocate such hatred against gay people and always go on about it in many cases have something to hide. |
Tamsier
Serere heritage. Serere religion. Serere to the end.
Roog a fa ha. |
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anna
Netherlands
730 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 16:12:01
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How sweet, Fee  . I am truly grateful for your support. Let's just hope Prince was referring to that 
Tamsier, what took you so long?
Never mind folks, i would like to use my favourite Gambian's favourite quotation: who knows it, feels it.........
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When an old African dies, it is as if a whole library has burnt down.
Amadou Hampate Ba (Mali) |
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Prince
507 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 23:28:24
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quote:
Originally posted by kobo
I didn't get your point clear! What do you mean? Whom ("these people") are you refering to and which communities
I was referring to the mental asylums that let out people who commit or condone such sacrilegious acts. Which sane person would get into the business of fighting the dead? If they are truly believers, they should be happy that the guy is going to meet his creator who supposedly dispenses fair justice.
Word is, most of these people who spend a significant amount of their energy hate mongering are actually closet homosexuals. They remind me of Senator Larry Craig. http://www.buzzle.com/articles/150994.html |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 10:31:13
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quote:
Originally posted by kobo
Kayjatta please can you please forward what evolution explains on reproductive cycle ("making babies"), life & death?
I am not sure I got your question right Kobo, but nonetheless here is my answer:
The human reproductive cycle begins at puberty, roughly in the early teens but slightly earlier in girls than in boys and there is an evolutionary reason for that, I will explain if you ask me to. The age of puberty has been falling over a period of time now due largely to improvements in nutrition. It ends at menopause for women and death for men  .
At puberty the reproductive organs develop and the adolescent body is awashed with reproductive hormones, mainly testosterone for boys and estrogen for girls. In girls, the ovaries start making eggs (ova) and ovulation begins as noticed in first menstrual period. In boys sperm production begins and nocturnal dreams (the so-called wet dreams may be observed). At this period the adolescent brain may be also saturated with drug-like dopamines that make the young teenagers feel and act like they are perpetually on stage and they are the whole world's center of attraction. They are very vulnerable to infatuation (love at first sight) and sexual experimentation is (to tell the truth) surprising very common. In our primate cousins (chimps, baboons and gorillas) the young males at this stage will leave their parents' troop (group) to avoid incest and join new groups to mate with females that are not related to them by blood. Human beings also at some point leave home (presumably either for college or work but truth-to-be-told) to essentially spread their genes with exotic stock. It is an evolutionary imperative. The evolutionary purpose of life is to propagate DNA. In some species of living things the parents produce large quantities of young ones and they die off immediately. They have carried out their evolutionary obligation to life. Some species produce a small number of young ones and immediately abandon them and move on to make more babies, some watch over their babies for a short period of time. Yet humans and their primate relatives do not only have long gestation (pregnancy) periods but also many years of helpless infancy. Therefore, the need for parents to live long and raise their offsprings is important.
During this adolescent period serial monogamy (dating multiple partners but one partner at a time) which is the hallmark of human sexual behavior is experimented. It is widely documented that those youngsters (between 18 and 27 years old)who tie the knot (marry)during this period of high sexual and behavioral fluidity register the highest rate of divorce (again the invisible hand of evolution is at play here. I can explain this later).
At some point in their life time, most human beings eventually marry bear and raise children. And even after divorce they still remarry. That is the norm, since you like to talk about what is normal and abnormal. Since we are talking about what is normal or abnormal, Kobo you will be surprised that during this human or primate monogamous relationships far too many partners (spouses) sneak away to copulate with secret lovers and some variety stock. Males reap enormous evolutionary benefit form this since it enables them propagate their DNA as much as possible, while females amass resources and build social networks to ensure survival of their offsprings.
Now I agree this is contoversial, but this is the evolutionary question i presume you have asked me to put forward.
I have in essence dealt with the human reproductive cycle at two levels. One is the biological/physiological level {development of reproductive hormones and organs, the production of gametes (sperms and eggs), pregnancy and childbirth, and if no pregnancy then menstruation}. Two is the social level {infatuation, love, attachment,marriage,philandering (cheating), divorce, and remarriage.
I will go back to the issue of abnormality you were talking about. kobo you will be surprised how our primate close relatives (chimps, baboons and gorillas) deal with issues of incest, rape, and other sexual and property crimes. Sometimes you begin to wonder whether humans are special at all but for a big brain and a big penis. There is very little that is normal about human sexual behavior. Its all been an experimentation. It has all been about the survival of the fittest. Those who succeed in passing on their genes survive and inherit this world. The norm has been a marriage between one male and one female raising their own offsprings. As far as humans are concerned that social institution has largely failed. What we are ended up with is all that may be abnormal. Co-habitation (experimental marriage), reconstituted family (spouses with children from previous relationsps), single parents, no parent households, and all the other combinations you can think of.
I agree that homosexuality may be abnormal, but let's face it Kobo that is not the reason you condemn it. That cannot be your reason because there are other abnormal human sexual and other nature and behavior that you have not objected to. For example, if by abnormal you mean an act or condition that is not by the majority, then polygamy, teenage marriage (under 18), albinism, co-habitaion, reconstituted families,celebacy and many others are all abnormal. Remeber that polygamy, co-habitaion, and marriage to under 18 all cause outrage in some societies today.
I do not endorse or subscribe to homosexuality, but I do think it is a human rights issue, and people should be respected for who they are.
You said the sexual posture of homosexuals is abnormal because it is of the lowly monkeys. Kobo again you will be surprised that our relatives, the higher monkeys, long before human beings, evolved and perfected face-to-face sex.They are missionaries! You will also be surprised that even in male-female relations humans (both the highly moral ones and those not so moral) have engaged in steamy rumps and orals orgies. I am not even talking about the Clinton White House okay ?
You know there is a concept introduced into psychology by Karl Gustav Jung called the "shadow". I end with that. |
Edited by - kayjatta on 08 Jun 2009 11:45:35 |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 01:54:00
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quote:
Originally posted by fee_sweetie
quote:
Originally posted by Prince
Why do they keep on releasing these people into our communities??
I think Prince was referring to the certain Closed Minded, Barbaric, Shallow, Discriminating, Backward thinking people of Bantaba.
Hats off to you Anna, I think its all fallen on deaf ears but you gave it your best shot. Your posts where strong, intelligent and spoken by a woman that lives in the 21ST CENTURY and doesn't judge a person by their Race, Religion or Sexuality.
I think people that agreed with the actions of these ludicrous pathetic people are disgusting and I hope for the sake of their family they're dead bodies are never mistreated in this way.
Sexuality is nothing but being either a Man or Woman if you are a normal person? Sexual instincts emanates from someone's passion & choice that suits you but not the human physiology! Lifestyles can vary but not these two distinctions of either being a Man or Woman?
In my opinion erotica is different from sex; for sex is not all about kisses, cuddle, fingers & all activities of foreplay? Thats why gay/lesbians go beyond those activities? I wonder why they (lesbians) resort to using vibrators of male organs to simulate penetration and the gay (men) use it between themselves and actually missing the goal posts?
Noone have answered my question on gay/lesbian realtionship? What are they mates, buddies, partners, husband & wife if they have the right to marry? Is their relationship a husband & wife relationship or sex partners?
Yes for 21st century is all about animal instincts on pornography, fornication & free-sex lifestyles without regard to dignity of human race!
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mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 09:57:04
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Wow...Anna I didn't know you badly needed the likes of Tamsier and like minded co to come along and celebrate any empty victories you are claiming. This is not a zero-sum game! I believe you are once again missing the whole point of this discourse and bantaba for that matter. First you had a problem me posting this story here and now you believe people who dont think like you are close minded, babaric and backwords. These perceptions to say the least do not surprise me at all.
In any case, I am not gonna celebrate any victories, nor do I need any commiserations for any losses. Rather, I commend the people of Thies for an act of courage in determining what is fitting behaviour of members of their communities. Clearly, we may see very few issues, if at all any with the same lenses. To reiterate my point once again, homosexuality is a vice that in the eyes of so many people is abominable and unfitting for the dignified behaviour of human beings. |
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 10:19:03
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| This is not "the people of Thies" as such. There is no declaration or "determination" by the people of Thies that homosexuals will not be buried in Muslim community cemeteries. Rather this heinous act is committed by hooligans (I do not mean British soccer fans)... |
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toubab1020
12314 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 10:49:47
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quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
This is not "the people of Thies" as such. There is no declaration or "determination" by the people of Thies that homosexuals will not be buried in Muslim community cemeteries. Rather this heinous act is committed by hooligans (I do not mean British soccer fans)...
Quite Right Kay,your reply though has ensured the continuation of this topic by those who disagree with what you say,no names mentioned! |
"Simple is good" & I strongly dislike politics. You cannot defend the indefensible.
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 22:42:15
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Quotes frm Kayjatta; "I do not endorse or subscribe to homosexuality, but I do think it is a human rights issue, and people should be respected for who they are."
They can only be either male or female! None under any scientific biological classification? No new species can be created
Behaviours, attitudes & instincts are different from what type of sex you are? Human phsycology is a wide field?
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Edited by - kobo on 10 Jun 2009 22:47:11 |
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mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2009 : 17:24:23
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| Kay, I think we can all agree for once that actions speak louder than words. What happened in Thies as the saying goes, is a shot that really reverberated wide and far. I believe what they did has more weight than any declaration speech of any sorts. I dont care if one or two people who actually participated. The point is, as far as we know, Thies as a whole did not object. In short, the will of the people of Thies was carried out. |
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2009 : 22:22:57
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Homosexuality is not natural, it is a learnt behaviour/choice. However, other than adoption they should enjoy all the rights others have. I condemn all the discrimination against them. I also defend Muslims as much as others defend homosexuals. Gays are not muslims. Homosexual life style is denying main principle of Islam. It is a life style. If you are not muslim why bother going to Islamic cemetary! Homosexuals should not go to Islamic cemetary.
anna
While others defends homosexuals rights, they should also respect muslims. Islamic cemetary is not a 'public' place. It is not a state place. It is religious place. Government or non-muslims have no right to dictate their secular agenda. It is Islamic cemetary. It is not christian cemetary or jewish. It is not a secular institution. It is Islamic. Let me repeat. IT IS ISLAMIC. Secular people do not have right to dictate their ideologies on them. You do not have right to tell muslims if homosexual can go to ISLAMIC cemetary. You have right to defend homosexuals but you have no right to tell us how an religious community to follow their rituals. What is next? Are you going to tell us how to pray next? Instead of Mecca should we face up to Pyramids?
Muslims also do not have right to dictate their values homosexuals who are not muslims. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2009 : 22:26:48
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Turk
How do you tell if someone is homosexual before you allow burial in cemetery??? Not all homosexuals are 'camp'. Not all homosexuals are practising gay sex.
Is there a test you would apply??
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2009 : 22:30:48
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Do you really believe there are no gay Muslims??
Of course there is!!!! They will just learn to hide it well!!! |
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