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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
 Posted - 29 May 2009 : 07:31:31
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quote:
Originally posted by mansasulu
I think there is a fundamental difference in how we perceive homosexuality. I believe people become homosexuals/sodomites by choice. I do not buy into all the genetic predisposition argument and crap that comes along with it. Trust me, if I believe that people dont become homosexuals by choice we wont be having this discussion.
I believe the people in Senegal are within their rights to determine who gets buried in their graves. I wont be surprised if the family of the homosexual who was disinterred were advised not to use the burial grounds.
Mansasulu, you need to broaden your pesrpective a little bit. There is plenty of expert evidence that homosexuality is not entirely a learned behavior. Actually it is a little bit of both nature and nurture. While you may believe that homosexuality is sinful, there is nothing perhaps in the Quran (the book you claim to follow) or elsewhere that homosexuals cannot be Muslims.
The problem here is not your wish not be buried near a homosexual. You have a right to be buried anywhere you wish or not to be buried at all, the problem is that you statements appear to support the removal or denial of burial of a homosexual in a public cemetary. That has an air of uneasy intolerance and discrimination to it ...
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mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2009 : 14:44:17
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Kay, homosexuality is a perverted way of life. The people of Thies decided enough is enough and that they are not going to tolerate it in their society. I fully concur with their decision. You bet it is discriminatory against homosexuals and that is the whole point since they chose to become homosexuals. Perhaps this discriminatory policy will serve as a deterrent to other aspiring homosexuals.
I make no apologies whatsoever. I meant what I said and I said what I meant. What happened to a society deciding a code of conduct for its members to abide by? If you wanna be a part of a society uphold the values and standards of that society. |
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2009 : 04:54:04
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kayjatta
If one is homosexual, he or she can not be muslim. It is like claiming being muslim but denying Allah. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2009 : 08:33:18
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Turk the Christian church has bigots that believe that too.
You cant be a true Christian and be gay.
CLEARLY MANY MANY Muslims ARE GAY..like wise many Christians are gay.
All these sort of statements do is make the individuals life more difficult. Many such people end up commiting suicide because of their inner torment.
Where is compassion, understanding and love in this discussion?
IF you consider yourself a religious person you are supposed to be loving and forgiving to your fellow man.
You may consider ther ACT of homosexuality immoral. BUT we should be able to separate that from the person and LOVE the person.
IF you believe in GOD then do you believe people are made in Gods image? Or that God made them?
TOLERANCE and UNDERSTANDING is what is needed.
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anna
Netherlands
730 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2009 : 12:17:26
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You may consider ther ACT of homosexuality immoral. BUT we should be able to separate that from the person and LOVE the person.
??????????????
Bev, what do you mean with this?
I cannot see how this could be done. It sounds like 'love the person, but ignore the fact that he/she is a homosexual' = ignore a very important aspect of this person's personality = do not accept him/her.
Anyway, this topic was about the ghastly and disrespectful way of dealing with a dead body. To me, what was done was lower than low because in my view and in my society homosexuality is not a crime.
Mansasula, who was talking about apologies? No need, we are all familiar with you point of view. |
When an old African dies, it is as if a whole library has burnt down.
Amadou Hampate Ba (Mali) |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 31 May 2009 : 05:55:59
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bev
It has nothing to do with it. You cant be true muslim and be gay. In islam, it is forbidden. You cant have all.
Off course many muslims are gay. But that does not mean they are muslims. Once you became gay/declare that you are gay that violates the fundamental of Islam.
My proposal is sound. If you are gay, you should go to secular cemetary as if a christian not to be buried in shaman cemetary or whatever.
I have a compassion, understanding and love for them. But I also have love for my religion too.
I am not religious person but at the same time, as much as I have consideration for gays, I have considerations for my brothers and sisters and most important my beliefs.
I am considering homosexuality immoral and abnormal. And I am against them to face any discrimination. But I am also against discrimination to muslims too.
God made everything. God made Hitler and pedophiles too, but I dont love them.
Governments should take action and create secular cemetaries. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 31 May 2009 : 08:27:59
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| In UK most secular people are cremated. |
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jammin
Jamaica
149 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2009 : 03:15:33
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quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
Mansasulu, you need to broaden your pesrpective a little bit.
These are the type of words used by the gay community and their supporters,advocating tolerance and acceptance of gays.
quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
There is plenty of expert evidence that homosexuality is not entirely a learned behavior.
Neither is there expert conclusive evidence proving that it isn't learned behaviour.
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Like a colossus He doth bestride the Narrow World |
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black orchid
United Kingdom
74 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2009 : 17:35:15
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quote:
Originally posted by mansasulu
I dont know about y'all, but I don't wanna be buried in the same burial grounds with a known homosexual let alone next to one.
they probably wouldn't want to be buried next to you either....
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mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2009 : 18:16:41
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quote:
Originally posted by black orchid
they probably wouldn't want to be buried next to you either....
Tell them the feeling is mutual then... |
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2009 : 07:22:15
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Okay let me put it this way so Turk (and everyone) can understand what I am trying to say here:
1. Which of the following is the most serious offense in Islam?
a. murder
b. adultry/fornication
c. homosexuality
d. usury
2.
a. if anyone commits any of these offenses but still observes the five pillars of Islam (Iman, salat, Sawm Ramadan, Zakat, and maybe Hajj), is he/she still a Muslim or not? What qualifies one to be a Muslim? Do you have to be perfect to be a Muslim?
b. Is any of these imperfect people who nonetheless upholds the basic tenets of Islam eligible for burial in an Islamic community cemetery? Is it justifiable that their bodies are dug up by hooligans and thrown at their bereaved family and relatives? |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2009 : 09:13:12
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In Christianity there is a saying...let he who is without sin cast the first stone....
It acknowledges individuals lack of perfection.
If only perfect people can be Muslim...well there wouldnt be many! |
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serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2009 : 10:11:45
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quote:
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Originally posted by mansasulu
I think there is a fundamental difference in how we perceive homosexuality. I believe people become homosexuals/sodomites by choice. I do not buy into all the genetic predisposition argument and crap that comes along with it. Trust me, if I believe that people dont become homosexuals by choice we wont be having this discussion.
Mansasulu, the question if someone is homosexual by choice or by nature is not a matter of what you personally believe, but a matter of proven facts. We know that there are even homosexual animals. If it is true what you 'believe' - what do you think, does a male cat say: "Wow, today I am going to be really bad and have sex with our neighbour's handsome tomcat!"?? And I don't 'believe' that there are homosexual animals - I saw it with my proper eyes.
If it is true that animals mostly act on natural instincts, and if you believe that homosexuality is unnatural, then there should not be one single homosexual (or bisexual) animal in this whole wide world. |
Edited by - serenata on 02 Jun 2009 10:13:08 |
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mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2009 : 15:58:25
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| Seranata, with all due respect. I was waiting to see your "proven facts" but disappointedly didn't see any. For God sake, we are talking about HUMANS! The best of God's creation not lower creatures. If you have scientific, theological, or any other form of quantifiable evidence than human are predisposed genetically to homosexual behaviour please put it up. You seeing it with your proper eyes is not evidence...its a point of view. And I mean that literally. |
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
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Moe
USA
2326 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2009 : 17:54:50
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http://news.worldwild.org/the-gay-animal-kingdom
http://www.gaywired.com/article.cfm?id=11034§ion=9
quote:
Originally posted by serenata
quote:
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Originally posted by mansasulu
I think there is a fundamental difference in how we perceive homosexuality. I believe people become homosexuals/sodomites by choice. I do not buy into all the genetic predisposition argument and crap that comes along with it. Trust me, if I believe that people dont become homosexuals by choice we wont be having this discussion.
Mansasulu, the question if someone is homosexual by choice or by nature is not a matter of what you personally believe, but a matter of proven facts. We know that there are even homosexual animals. If it is true what you 'believe' - what do you think, does a male cat say: "Wow, today I am going to be really bad and have sex with our neighbour's handsome tomcat!"?? And I don't 'believe' that there are homosexual animals - I saw it with my proper eyes.
If it is true that animals mostly act on natural instincts, and if you believe that homosexuality is unnatural, then there should not be one single homosexual (or bisexual) animal in this whole wide world.
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I am Jebel Musa better yet rock of Gibraltar,either or,still a stronghold and a Pillar commanding direction
The GPU wants Me Hunted Down for what I don't know ..... |
Edited by - Moe on 02 Jun 2009 18:06:39 |
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