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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
 Posted - 03 May 2007 : 22:58:13
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Mansasula. if you are against Democracy because it doesnt belong to Africa, then you should be against Islam too.
If you are a purist,you should look at African and particularly Gambian society for a solution.
Nothing would give me more pleasure than Gambians finding solutions to Gambian problems.Especially if their solution had noting to do with religion or tribe!  
Gambians in Gambia are relaxed and easy going people. That is what I like about them. Mansasulas more fundamental approach just doesnt ring true with Gambia to me. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2007 : 22:58:13
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Mansasula. if you are against Democracy because it doesnt belong to Africa, then you should be against Islam too.
If you are a purist,you should look at African and particularly Gambian society for a solution.
Nothing would give me more pleasure than Gambians finding solutions to Gambian problems.Especially if their solution had noting to do with religion or tribe!
Gambians in Gambia are relaxed and easy going people. That is what I like about them. Mansasulas more fundamental approach just doesnt ring true with Gambia to me. |
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salimina
253 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 00:01:13
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Mansa,
Wonderful pieces! my first reaction was the level of our DEEN.karamba supported that point.We can only practiced real islamic principles and way of governance if we are muslims ourselves.Our religion is seriously in disrepair. Very diluted indeed.So any system designed towards islam will be another serious mistake just like the western form of democracy.The way foward is lets choose the way that best suits us.Mixture of both. |
Edited by salimina |
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salimina
253 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 00:01:13
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Mansa,
Wonderful pieces! my first reaction was the level of our DEEN.karamba supported that point.We can only practiced real islamic principles and way of governance if we are muslims ourselves.Our religion is seriously in disrepair. Very diluted indeed.So any system designed towards islam will be another serious mistake just like the western form of democracy.The way foward is lets choose the way that best suits us.Mixture of both. |
Edited by salimina |
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ylowe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 05:54:39
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quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
Ylowe: i am sorry , but your answer is not a bit helpful. You were absolutely right that not all ideas that sound good on paper are practicable. However , for the purpose of enlightenment you need to point out for us which ideas you think are not practicale in Gambia's situation. We will all benefit from that knowledge.
Come on let's talk, the bantaba is open.
I cannot tell you what works or doesn't work for the Gambia cause am not in the Gambia and never held any public office to manifest and execute my ideas. i am here to learn and share the little that i know so no hard feelings. Presently putting my ideas into actions with my employer. May be someday will be able to do it for the Gambia our homeland. I will continue to share my ideas with bantaba in bits and pieces. bye |
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ylowe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 05:54:39
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quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
Ylowe: i am sorry , but your answer is not a bit helpful. You were absolutely right that not all ideas that sound good on paper are practicable. However , for the purpose of enlightenment you need to point out for us which ideas you think are not practicale in Gambia's situation. We will all benefit from that knowledge.
Come on let's talk, the bantaba is open.
I cannot tell you what works or doesn't work for the Gambia cause am not in the Gambia and never held any public office to manifest and execute my ideas. i am here to learn and share the little that i know so no hard feelings. Presently putting my ideas into actions with my employer. May be someday will be able to do it for the Gambia our homeland. I will continue to share my ideas with bantaba in bits and pieces. bye |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 07:46:50
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Dbaldeh:
While it is true that Gambians went to the polls twice and Jammeh got elected , we cannot close our eyes to the fact that elections cannot be free and fair under the present circumstances in the Gambia.
Even though polling day itself was peaceful and free of major hitches , the run up to the election has witnessed the removal ,arrset and detention of IEC officials. Remember the IEC is already a pseudo-independent body that continues to be influenced by the ruling APRC. Also , the high-handed role of the security forces in pre-election campaign , the intimidation of civil servants , and the highly controversial voter registration process all added up to tilt any election in favor of Jammeh. Gambian elections are sadly plebescitary.It is a systemic problem.
My argument is that under the status quo in the Gambia , any president is likely to be autocratic unless he/she is very extra-ordinary and does the first things first. "? That is the relatioship between the branches of government (executive , legislature , and judiciary)needs to be re-ordered so as to facilitate proper oversight (checks and balances). Also the relationship between the president and the parties including his own party needs to be re-defined. Currently , there is very little power sharing in the Gambia government. Too much power is concentrated in the executive. The president has absolute control not only over the government but also over his party. Consequently all power emanates from the executive. All power should emanate from the people.
People begged Jammeh to run as civilian" ? Do you rememeber Jawara in 1992 when Saikou Sabally and others mobilized "elders" to beg him to stay after announcing his retirement .This is not new in the Gambia and Jammeh still enjoys it , thanks to Yankuba Touray and Fatoumata J. Ceesay.
I am a staunch believer in the separation of state and religion.Therefore "give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar and to God what belongs to God " , William Shapespeare . In many ways I concur with Gambiabev's position on religion , but Dr. Peters , a Gambian surgeon , novelist and poet questioned in one his poems how this world would be like without this great religions.
Thanks. |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 07:46:50
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Dbaldeh:
While it is true that Gambians went to the polls twice and Jammeh got elected , we cannot close our eyes to the fact that elections cannot be free and fair under the present circumstances in the Gambia.
Even though polling day itself was peaceful and free of major hitches , the run up to the election has witnessed the removal ,arrset and detention of IEC officials. Remember the IEC is already a pseudo-independent body that continues to be influenced by the ruling APRC. Also , the high-handed role of the security forces in pre-election campaign , the intimidation of civil servants , and the highly controversial voter registration process all added up to tilt any election in favor of Jammeh. Gambian elections are sadly plebescitary.It is a systemic problem.
My argument is that under the status quo in the Gambia , any president is likely to be autocratic unless he/she is very extra-ordinary and does the first things first. "? That is the relatioship between the branches of government (executive , legislature , and judiciary)needs to be re-ordered so as to facilitate proper oversight (checks and balances). Also the relationship between the president and the parties including his own party needs to be re-defined. Currently , there is very little power sharing in the Gambia government. Too much power is concentrated in the executive. The president has absolute control not only over the government but also over his party. Consequently all power emanates from the executive. All power should emanate from the people.
People begged Jammeh to run as civilian" ? Do you rememeber Jawara in 1992 when Saikou Sabally and others mobilized "elders" to beg him to stay after announcing his retirement .This is not new in the Gambia and Jammeh still enjoys it , thanks to Yankuba Touray and Fatoumata J. Ceesay.
I am a staunch believer in the separation of state and religion.Therefore "give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar and to God what belongs to God " , William Shapespeare . In many ways I concur with Gambiabev's position on religion , but Dr. Peters , a Gambian surgeon , novelist and poet questioned in one his poems how this world would be like without this great religions.
Thanks. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 08:12:55
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Without religions we would be without many beautiful buildings and lots of wonderful music.
But without religion we wouldnt have had alot of the wars that have been in Gods name. We wouldnt have alot of the hatred that is in the world.
If war and hatred is in human nature (?) perhaps we would have found a different reason to go war? |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 08:12:55
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Without religions we would be without many beautiful buildings and lots of wonderful music.
But without religion we wouldnt have had alot of the wars that have been in Gods name. We wouldnt have alot of the hatred that is in the world.
If war and hatred is in human nature (?) perhaps we would have found a different reason to go war? |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 13:31:28
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The debate about role of Islam and other religions on Gambian Democracy & Politics have been vibrant. However its my opinion that SECURALISM, DIVERSITY, MULTI-CULTURALISM & RELIGION on STATE matters (i.e. POLITICS, DEMOCRACY & ECONOMICS, SOCIAL-WELFARE etc) are adddressed through THE CONSITUTION. Some of the suggestions and proposals may concur with my opinion that we should consider engaging some elderly customary leaders including RELIGIOUS LEADERS FROM ALL DENOMINATIONS to be given AUTHORITY to ADVISE ON CERTAIN DECISIONS and PARTICIPATE IN THE RUNNING OF STATE AFFAIRS. We may recommend them as PRESIDENTIAL ADVISERS on DELICATE MORAL & SOCIAL WELFARE ISSUES. To sum up, these can come up THROUGH RECOMMENDATIONS IN IMPROVING THE GAMBIAN CONSITUTION. Presently the traditional visits to STATE HOUSE is being POLITICISE to HEAP LOTS OF PRAISE SINGING AND DANCE TO THE TUNE OF THE PRESIDENT AND THE PRESENT GOVERNING PARTY.
Thanks to Bantanba for accomodation us as this forum is one of its kind in working on open and fair debate on NATIONAL ISSUES.
To Karamba, I appreciate your interventions but I believe the proposed UNITED NATIONAL FRONT is a good platform that can start OUR NETWORKING AND EXTENSION OF OUR MESSAGES to other forums for e.g STGDP, All political(both APRC & opposition parties), other Gambian websites and Gambian media.
For The Gambia Our Homeland!
We Strive and Work & Pray!
That ALL MAY LIVE IN UNITY! FREEDOM! & PEACE EACH DAY!
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Edited by - kobo on 04 May 2007 16:19:57 |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 13:31:28
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The debate about role of Islam and other religions on Gambian Democracy & Politics have been vibrant. However its my opinion that SECURALISM, DIVERSITY, MULTI-CULTURALISM & RELIGION on STATE matters (i.e. POLITICS, DEMOCRACY & ECONOMICS, SOCIAL-WELFARE etc) are adddressed through THE CONSITUTION. Some of the suggestions and proposals may concur with my opinion that we should consider engaging some elderly customary leaders including RELIGIOUS LEADERS FROM ALL DENOMINATIONS to be given AUTHORITY to ADVISE ON CERTAIN DECISIONS and PARTICIPATE IN THE RUNNING OF STATE AFFAIRS. We may recommend them as PRESIDENTIAL ADVISERS on DELICATE MORAL & SOCIAL WELFARE ISSUES. To sum up, these can come up THROUGH RECOMMENDATIONS IN IMPROVING THE GAMBIAN CONSITUTION. Presently the traditional visits to STATE HOUSE is being POLITICISE to HEAP LOTS OF PRAISE SINGING AND DANCE TO THE TUNE OF THE PRESIDENT AND THE PRESENT GOVERNING PARTY.
Thanks to Bantanba for accomodation us as this forum is one of its kind in working on open and fair debate on NATIONAL ISSUES.
To Karamba, I appreciate your interventions but I believe the proposed UNITED NATIONAL FRONT is a good platform that can start OUR NETWORKING AND EXTENSION OF OUR MESSAGES to other forums for e.g STGDP, All political(both APRC & opposition parties), other Gambian websites and Gambian media.
For The Gambia Our Homeland!
We Strive and Work & Pray!
That ALL MAY LIVE IN UNITY! FREEDOM! & PEACE EACH DAY!
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Edited by - kobo on 04 May 2007 16:19:57 |
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mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 15:16:59
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Kobo, may I remind you that the constitution is irrevant in the Gambia. Jammeh is the defacto constitution in the Gambia. He does what he wants regardless of what is stated in the constitution. Everyday, Jammeh abuses that constitution and there is no body to challenge him.
Salimina, like i said before, I used to be a firm believer in democracy but Alhamdullillah I dont any more. The only way out for us is to turn back to Allah, because without that our condition will never change. Why should we mixed when we can turn our islam around. It seems that we know where our deficiencies are...weak iman, and we know what the prescription for weak iman is. Mixing is a quick fix solution. There is an old saying that "if you dont do it right the first time, it will cost a lot more to do it all over again."
Our purpose in life is to worship Allah. He owns this world and everything that is in it. Let us not be carried away because we think we are eloquent, "advanced," and educated etc. Gambia is being giving to us in trust by Allah. He told us how to deal in our affairs and we think it is okay to thump our noses on the laws of Allah and follow the ideas of a certain Aristotle ? |
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
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mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 15:16:59
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Kobo, may I remind you that the constitution is irrevant in the Gambia. Jammeh is the defacto constitution in the Gambia. He does what he wants regardless of what is stated in the constitution. Everyday, Jammeh abuses that constitution and there is no body to challenge him.
Salimina, like i said before, I used to be a firm believer in democracy but Alhamdullillah I dont any more. The only way out for us is to turn back to Allah, because without that our condition will never change. Why should we mixed when we can turn our islam around. It seems that we know where our deficiencies are...weak iman, and we know what the prescription for weak iman is. Mixing is a quick fix solution. There is an old saying that "if you dont do it right the first time, it will cost a lot more to do it all over again."
Our purpose in life is to worship Allah. He owns this world and everything that is in it. Let us not be carried away because we think we are eloquent, "advanced," and educated etc. Gambia is being giving to us in trust by Allah. He told us how to deal in our affairs and we think it is okay to thump our noses on the laws of Allah and follow the ideas of a certain Aristotle ? |
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 16:18:27
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Mansa we are addressing the PRESENT POLITICAL SITUATION AND DEMOCRATIC STRUCTURES that are in-place, dictates the STEWARDSHIP OF THE STATE, victimisation, survival and livelihood of THE CITIZENS OF THE GAMBIA.
The COUNCIL OF ELDERS & RELIGIOUS HEADS should be given mandate and AUTHORITY in the running of The State, seeking advise on certain moral & welfare issues. They have other roles to play through their PREACHINGS TOWARDS THE PATH OF GOD AND GOOD MORAL VALUES, BUILDING THE COMMUNITY AND MAKING THE SOCIETY PROSPER.
God bless you all! |
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