| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Formby
United Kingdom
246 Posts |
 Posted - 01 May 2006 : 23:52:35
|
Bamba, with respect, I suspect you are an institutionalised sexist of 'a certain age' and simply fear change. Your statements about 'rampant feminism' and 'great danger' to Gambian society suggest it. The saying you mention and the context you put it in..'women and money lead people to fight'... Well Bamba, we are not chattels you know. Yes, we too are 'people'. I can't speak with much authority about how the typical Gambian woman lives but I can tell you that not so long ago here in the UK, women weren't 'allowed' in many jobs, and had to give up work on getting married, earned less for the same job, could not get a mortgage from a bank to buy a house, could be beaten by their husbands and the police didn't involve themselves, could, in fact, be treated like chattels with the support of the law. Thanks to several decades of the movement you disparagingly dismiss as 'feminism' that's no longer the case. And guess what? The sky hasn't fallen in, the world hasn't ended, the economy hasn't collapsed, the 'youth of today' has not gone to the dogs, it's all OK. It's just that 'people' are allowed to be 'people' now.
Don't fear feminism in Gambia, Bamba, think of it as freeing. In fact, since gender roles aren't so rigid any more here in the UK, there are plenty of men who stay home and raise the kids while the wife/partner works and they're no longer ridiculed for not being 'proper men'. In fact it's quite normal.
Isn't it better that we're free to be individuals? Isn't it better for society too? |
Edited by - Formby on 01 May 2006 23:57:02 |
 |
|
|
bamba
Sweden
401 Posts |
Posted - 02 May 2006 : 01:57:50
|
Formby, dont make wrong accusations. U need to follow the flow of exchanges, in this particular issue, rather than grab just one part of it. I cited three proverbs on money and women from three different Gambian languages. These proverbs are even used by women in Gambia when they context well in conversations. The proverbs were there well before my parents were born.
It doesnt matter how old I am, no-one needs to tell me that changes, in all aspects of life, are taking place by the day.If modern feminisim is not only about gender equality, but also about changes of languages and proverbs, then modern feminism is going to be extremely tough. If modern feminism is to be used for personal reasons other than gender equality, the course would then be derailed. |
Bamba |
|
|
|
kassma
334 Posts |
Posted - 02 May 2006 : 02:56:26
|
quote:
Originally posted by jambo
kassma, you asked for a sstory, i have posted one on bantaba before here is the short version. of how a family member can be spiteful if money is concerned. i got a young man a scholarship to college in Gambia, he called me in to ask for the money so that his mother could by ram for tobaski. I though houw could a mother stand in the way of ther sons progress, but other gambians on Bantaba adivised that this could be the way they are. In the same compound, one of his uncle knew that I wanted to help them with their education, I asked that they give me the boys school report, because i wanted to see if i could get him a scholarship in the first place, on the day i was leaving I was given an envelope with a school report, guess what it belong to the uncle.
If I had not had my wits about me I would have filled in visa, school, finance report the boy any to find that the uncle would have taken the papers.
Some of the families in gambia are mean but that is the world over, I am surprised that they would want to stop progress, or buy mobile phone and not pay school fees. What is fair to me is not fair to them.
I have other tales to tell but will save them for a rainy day.
these stories are so interesting to me simply cause they lack so much sense i usually like to spend time anayzing these people's behavior. i wonder how the boy replied. being in Gambia, he probably took that nonsense without saying anything so he wouldn't start any conflict. i was have raised he11. |
|
|
|
kassma
334 Posts |
Posted - 02 May 2006 : 03:16:56
|
quote:
Originally posted by bamba
Formby, dont make wrong accusations. U need to follow the flow of exchanges, in this particular issue, rather than grab just one part of it. I cited three proverbs on money and women from three different Gambian languages. These proverbs are even used by women in Gambia when they context well in conversations. The proverbs were there well before my parents were born.
It doesnt matter how old I am, no-one needs to tell me that changes, in all aspects of life, are taking place by the day.If modern feminisim is not only about gender equality, but also about changes of languages and proverbs, then modern feminism is going to be extremely tough. If modern feminism is to be used for personal reasons other than gender equality, the course would then be derailed.
what "personal reasons" are you talking about. i think we'all acknowledged that language can be sexist already, what we're talking about now is YOU being sexist and to say you being sexist is justified because the language you speak is sexist or that the women in your culture use the same sexist proverbs you do does not excuse nothing. i've already explained why those women are that way, you however have no excuse. |
|
|
|
jambo
3300 Posts |
Posted - 02 May 2006 : 08:39:52
|
kassma, you are right it would be okay to spend time with people before you do things, but I could spend a year there and only be shown what they want me to see. Most of these events were out of my hands. but how would you judge this one.
I pad school fees for one child who was selling peanuts on the beach i paid it direct to the school, and advised the head teacher that the family should not have a "refund", get the money back. On my return I wanted to see the child in the compound and take her and her brother out to the beach for the day, enter the "uncles", to be told "she is not allowed out of the compund it is not sage". "can you help you us", "how" i asked maybe with a business, NO I said, I asked the question "if i help you with a business 10,000dls for a shop, does that mean she can come to the beach, "YES" of course, I looked at them all, I told them in polite language, to pay for their own business, I see the child still selling on the beach and by petrol stations. but in 4 years time she will be married off. As i say my standards are not their standards. I thought if I paid the fees direct to the school things would be okay, but they decided that she "was not worth educating as she would be married soon", better to buy the family a business".
I am not daunted, but had to re think my strategy, i am going back to gambia in june to look and land with a view to build a house there in the next six months.
This is not an Gambian thing but a tribal issue, this could happen in Kenya, Nigeria, even on another continent. it was a learning curve for me.
If you are wondering my next project will be in Farafenni, let me take it to the villages, but i am sure i will have a story to tell on that one. |
|
|
|
kassma
334 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2006 : 02:37:00
|
quote:
Originally posted by jambo
kassma, you are right it would be okay to spend time with people before you do things, but I could spend a year there and only be shown what they want me to see. Most of these events were out of my hands. but how would you judge this one.
I pad school fees for one child who was selling peanuts on the beach i paid it direct to the school, and advised the head teacher that the family should not have a "refund", get the money back. On my return I wanted to see the child in the compound and take her and her brother out to the beach for the day, enter the "uncles", to be told "she is not allowed out of the compund it is not sage". "can you help you us", "how" i asked maybe with a business, NO I said, I asked the question "if i help you with a business 10,000dls for a shop, does that mean she can come to the beach, "YES" of course, I looked at them all, I told them in polite language, to pay for their own business, I see the child still selling on the beach and by petrol stations. but in 4 years time she will be married off. As i say my standards are not their standards. I thought if I paid the fees direct to the school things would be okay, but they decided that she "was not worth educating as she would be married soon", better to buy the family a business".
I am not daunted, but had to re think my strategy, i am going back to gambia in june to look and land with a view to build a house there in the next six months.
This is not an Gambian thing but a tribal issue, this could happen in Kenya, Nigeria, even on another continent. it was a learning curve for me.
If you are wondering my next project will be in Farafenni, let me take it to the villages, but i am sure i will have a story to tell on that one.
this blows my mind. first of all are you toubab? is that why they're acting like you're a bank or something. its sad that some people can stand in the way of a child's success. it also illustrates how Gambia is a sexist country cause if that was a boy, they would not block his education just because he was getting married soon. what nonsense, you are not a bank! i hope you don't let those silly people discourage you from helping others. |
|
|
|
jambo
3300 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2006 : 09:44:29
|
kassma, not sure when you last went to gambia, but it happens to people who are not toubabs, the problem was they did not think i would come back. Also I did not begrude the money, the fees where $30 a year, i have spent more than that on a meal. I believe in education so thought by paying for the school fees it would be less money out of the family budget. That was my thinking. I did not put the child in school she was already there. The family believe in education till she is 12, then she will gt married, that is what i meant by tribal, they were fula, early marriage is the norm for girl child.
It has not put me off but has changed my project.
Next woeful tale, tune.
|
|
|
|
bamba
Sweden
401 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2006 : 17:27:20
|
I have another side to this story. It's not typical fula tradition, it's typical poverty tradition. Any other father or uncle from any other Gambian tribe, to minimize the burden of poverty and to lessen mouths to feed, would have disposed of their girl kids thru marriages as soon as possible. Poverty is a phenomenon that exposes it victims, in third world counties, to all types of reprobates from the so called richer countries. Most of the wealth in richer countries are exploited from poorer ones.
Nothing is free in this world especially when gifts/help flow in from the most ordinary of richer countries. When shall we blacks begin to understand that nothing is free?
It's time for Gambians to vote in Halifa, Sidia and co who are going to prioritize education, health and agricuture. Priorities that will block our dear Gambia from filthy invaders with whatever they may have in mind. The black continent is bleeding and there are outsiders utilizing such vulnerabilities.
|
Bamba |
|
|
|
gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2006 : 21:02:44
|
It is my belief that women shouldnt marry until they are 18 minimum. Even this is early. How do you know your own mind?
To be married off for the convienence of the family is so sad......
|
|
|
|
toubab
Gambia
92 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2006 : 22:34:23
|
Bamba, could you enlighten me as to who these "filthy invaders" are, and Gambiabev, on a lighter note why only women!! are you implying men know their own mind at age 18!, I must know the wrong ones.
|
|
|
|
gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2006 : 07:37:29
|
oh no..men too...but in Gambia the young girls tend to be married off to older men dont they? Most Gambian men I have met are still single in their late 20s because they cant afford to marry.
Does anyone know the average age for marriage for men and women in Gambia? |
|
|
|
serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2006 : 13:37:00
|
It is interesting to see that men who are openly offensive to women and find nothing in insulting them become delicate like Mimosas when they hear the word 'feminism'. Oh... these feminists!! They are against men! What a crime!!!
Go back to your museum, old misogynists, and have yourself dusted from time to time. |
|
|
|
twinkly
United Kingdom
190 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2006 : 15:59:58
|
Why is it so hard to just accept a culture?
It has only been a discussion about culture, not one person's thoughts.
Yes, there is good and bad, but WE TOUBABS have to accept that there are cultures where things are done differently.
Serenata, I wonder what you like about the Gambia apart from the sunshine and your partner(who comes from the same culture by the way, but probably is so oppressed he can't live it out anymore).
We don't have to accept every single little thing, but we need to realise that it is not up to us toubabs to change the world and let everybody follow us because we are so perfect!!
Learn to accept each other, and communication will flow.
Gambiabev, I really like your style, your eyes are more and more opening.And eventhough you don't agree, you can just accept the fact that things are the way they are |
|
|
|
bamba
Sweden
401 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2006 : 16:55:06
|
The filthy invaders are those that globetrott looking for under age boys and girls to have sex with. Most men behind these filthy practices are, as statistics show, Europeans, Americans, Australians and New Zealanders. It's no excuse that the countries they travel to have paedophile networks. In such countries abject poverty, the horrendous injustices of our world, are always the causes behind. It's really beyond me how men can go to bed with men, let alone under age boys and girls. One cant have it all in this world. One can be rich and filthy as one can poor and clean, if the cleanlinss of the poor is not besmirched by the so called rich.
At very regular intervals, one can read in Swedish papers how paedophiles destroy the lives of toddlers in poorer countries. Luckily, some of them get bursted and locked up in different countries. Two British old hogs are currently serving a six year jail term respectively, since last month, for padophile acts with kids in an orphanage in Bombay,in India. U hear me right, orphans of all kids. One of the two has been helping this orphanage for the past eight years. The other one is a retired army whatever from the British army. Some people beg around in their rich countries to take down to poorer countries. As thank u for their generosities, they have access to the very poor kids for gratification of their animalistic sexual desires. Some people have no shame in them. |
Bamba |
Edited by - bamba on 04 May 2006 16:56:20 |
|
|
|
bamba
Sweden
401 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2006 : 17:17:29
|
Twinkly, I cant agree with u more. Accepting other peoples cultures is the answer. But some people are brought up to feel they are better than others. It's not true, one is not better than the other, but that's the way it is. Under such a stance, it's difficult to accept cultures of people one considers to be of lower breed.
There are people who use their education to get whatever the want. Get this from me, such people know always their targets, they know always who to go to. |
Bamba |
Edited by - bamba on 04 May 2006 17:23:29 |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
