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dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
 Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 08:49:49
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It is almost a month when a topic on "Who is Ousainou Darboe" was introduced to our general bantaba readers. Almost one thousand (1,000) people visited and read the posting, but only a handful opined on the subject.
Are readers affraid to air their opinions on a potential President of our nation in fear of attacks or have many readers simply lost hope on Darboe's leadership?
Certainly there must be a reason why people are not commenting...
Is it also because they don't know who he is? and if that is the case where have all the readers been when he was contesting all the past elections?
The importance of our discussions on our political leaders is not to castigate or call them names simply for hating or not supporting them. It is to understand who they are and what kind of leaders they will be when they are elected to office.
If bantaba were to conduct a survey on this man's electability purely base on leadership merits, what would the results be? Are our bantaba readers simply like many electorates in the Gambia where they vote for someone either base on tribe, local origin, or other social identities?
I certainly do not believe this is the case, at least bantaba readers are expected to be much more informed politically? Am I missing something or is this another mistry of "Don't ask Don't tell" just accept what you are told...
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Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 18:05:19
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Baldeh
It looks like you cannot stand Darboe and Jawara. Your blood pressure is always up when these two are discussed. I think you can answer all the questions you raised yourself. You grew up in Gambia and certainly have heard of him in 1981 against PPP.
You must have also herad about him for some ten years now. He is not new on the political scene. My believe is that people are really beaten up and with elections years away, its currently not very galvanizing.
As to tribes in politics thats not new. It has always been the same. Every region seems to nominate the tribe in the majority in Parliament from Kartong to Koina. Political democracry in the Gambia is very much linked to one's ancestral standing. Only Jawara managed to break the spell to come from one of the lowest to become a president. He had no historical or ancestral credentials to be a "ruler". From PS Njie, to Paul Baldeh, to Jammeh in Baddibu, Sheriff Dibba etc, politics in Africa was largely defined by one's ancestral standing.
Seku Touray rode on the fame of Samori Ture and won and so was Senghore, Modibo Keita(Sundiatta).
What do i know?
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“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 19:49:03
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Kon. Thanks for weighing in when many are silence. I would first of all disagree with you that I can't stand Darboe. Jawara you are definitely right I can't stand him anytime I think about the opportunities he squandered. I have no personal hatred against him or any human soul. I judge people base on their records and words.
I know you would probably disagree with me on Darboe but at some point I was a supporter of the UDP in private. While I had always been a part of PDOIS I did not think their political maturity would be easy explained to the Gambian voter.
Even during the NADD fiasco I had always maintained that UDP had the chance to lead if only their leadership were strong and bold and inclusive. A personal friend of mine who I always discuss politics with can attest to my conditional support for UDP. I don't have to appease anyone on that. I reserve the right to support or not to any party...
I know anytime I mention inclusive readers think am talking about tribe and diversity, but that is not what I mean. I mean they should have stood tall and offer to the smaller parties something for them to rally behind the UDP. Politics is all about give and take and therefore one had expected that with a party led coalition something will be offered to the smaller guys in return.
So you definitely are wrong in saying that I can't stand Darboe. I do have some serious reservation about his political judgement and I can strongly back my reservations with evidence if you want to engage me on that.
You may be right though people are beaten up so they want to stay away from politics for now. However, politics is a part of our daily lives and what happens today affects us tomorrow. while I don't expect people to start campaigning three years earlier, people should always be thinking about our long term solutions and thus the reason for our discussions now.
Lets hear from others too... |
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
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BambaLaye
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 22:30:36
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He's a spent force that squandered a great many opportunities with decisions bereft of sincerity of a rational leader...why bother?
Let him stay in the courts where he's doing a great job for bread, butter and humanity.
What? You want him to dye his hair (nyulal), hit the gym and lead a demonstration? Good luck with that!
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Edited by - BambaLaye on 24 Oct 2007 22:38:02 |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 01:56:19
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Every citizen should have a right to elect and be elected. That’s my principle. So let every person put him/herself up for the vote and the one who can gather more votes wins. Democracy is that simple.
So if APRC wins, that’s the choice of the people and that must be respected but its Darboe's right to stand for elections. Citizens then have a choice to vote for anyone.
Bambalye
As to whether Darboe is a spent force depends of which side your bread is buttered. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Can you for once read you signature title again
"Throughout history, it has been the inaction of those who could have acted, the indifference of those who should have known better, the silence of the voice of justice when it mattered most, that has made it possible for evil to triumph." -His Imperial Majesty Emperor Haile Selassie I
At least Darboe was not inactive; he went through a lot that you are not prepared to expose yourself to including me. So would you not then give him credit for his part in politics if you truly believe in the message of your signature title? Without UDP in politics, Gambia would have become a defacto one party state a long time ago.
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“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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BambaLaye
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 04:13:08
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Kondorongo:
Darboe may have acted but may I say one more time that he squandered a great many opportunities by making decisions bereft of sincerity of a genuine rational leader. I will stick by this characterization till he shows otherwise.
Yes he may have acted yes, but has also been indifferent to the greater good with a great many opportunities for a person who should have known better. He was silent when it mattered most and that has made it possible for the evil in Jammeh to truimph (Hail the imperial majesty Selassie I for his wisdom).
Put his age, his political record and the Gambian constitution in the same equation = spent force.
I did not, will not and shall not intend to be the leader of Gambia. He did, he did and he did again so what? Am I the subject of discussion or is it Darboe?
I gave Darboe credit when and where I thought he desreved it and I'm just one in a million and half. So what is your point, BTW? |
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Edited by - BambaLaye on 25 Oct 2007 04:14:28 |
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dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 09:45:37
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Kon. it is a myth and misrepresentation that without UDP Gambia would have been a one party state. This is not so... While the UDP was one of the first to emerge after political parties were banned, it is correct to say that infact PDOIS never went out of business despite Jammeh's threat.
Infact they stood trial for exercising their political right to publish foroyaa and in so doing engaged in political activities. It is honest to say that neither UDP nor any of the other parties makes any difference to Jammeh. Political opposition in the Gambia remain in effective.
I think we can still learn a lot from our discussion on the subject. If Darboe were to be President what kind of Cabinet would he appoint? How would he treat members of the current regime? What kind of economic and social policies would he institute? Would he put the past behind him in the name of national reconcialition? How would he handle the judiciary and respect for our constitution? These are fundamental questions we should be asking of any of our potential leaders including my own Ayatoyah sallah.
They are yet to be tested and as history dictates African leaders tend to change once they get into power. Who is more likely to be more effective in governing? Answer the questions if you can and educate the readership. That is what we need...
Lets intellectualize the debate and some day history will give us the chance to revisit our current discussion. That is my objective...
What is yours??? |
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 18:46:48
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quote:
Originally posted by dbaldeh
They are yet to be tested and as history dictates African leaders tend to change once they get into power. What is yours???
If I have to believe what you have said above, then why should we elect or go for a multiparty democracy since once selected they change?
We need to be honest here. UDP exerted more political pressure than any party in the Gambia until the emergence of NAAD as a Party. That is the truth. PDOIS was embraced by the few educated Gambians whilst the masses have no understanding what their message is. For over ten years, they can only have one MP.
Bambalaye
May i hasten to add that Haile Sellasie's alledged human rights record reallly bothers me. He sat over a country and plunged iit into ruins, an emaciated skeletons of human well qualified to be called the walking dead. Infact to an extent, that famine is synonymous to his country. I have been to Ethiopia many times and worked with their public officials and i have first hand what that country went through. So i find it hypocritical that he is talking about inaction, when his country men are being wasted in a senseless war, starved to death or have topped the list of the world's refugees. What did he do to stop that.
You keep on talking about Darboe squandering opportunities. Can you be more elaborate on those please? I beg your patience for being a dim-wit.
Do you want Darboe to take up arms and turn the country into chaos? Hell no. Gambia belongs to all of us. Any attempt to take power by means of force is unacceptable to me whether it is done by removing the current Government or any govt. in the future. It’s easy to sit behind a keyboard and say what one likes, but it’s another to put oneself up to face any uncharted territory.
Like or hate Darboe, it’s because of UDP that today we have a multiparty democracy. The idea of a one party state being contemplated around the elections in 2001 quickly dissipated with the mass support and turnout for UDP. I had not expected that that election would have passed peacefully. There was an air of silence right through out the country on election day and many embraced for the worst especially civil disobedience if Darboe had not recognised the results.
Part of the reason why a party called NDAM was formed. Some people who were out for a confrontation did not like the call Darboe made to State House conceding defeat and the fact that Jammeh called Darboe as his son was a suicide for some to accept. Traditionally there is that relationship between a Darboe and a Jammeh. In Mandinka its called SANAW, in wolof its called KAL.
I like to see our past presidents living in the Gambia providing moral support and wisdom to the generations to come. Its almost a rare occurrence in Africa where a former president is found at home. They either die in office or die in exile. The effect is a lack of institutional memory for a new party to transition and take off from where the other stopped. That’s same problem is what is making our public institutions suffer due to frequent hirings and firings with no handing-overs.
That sort of camaraderie is unknown in Gambian politics. What we knew was to burn down peoples homes as in the the 1960s or banish people from their villages and towns etc.
Those who make a living in politics would remember the campaign slogans for a one party state by a current Cabinet Member and even questioning why we need another party since the current one is building structures. That was the time the Jamahiriya influence was becoming well entrenched with Jobe in the driving seat. That was the time when Marina Parade was changed to Col. Muammar Ghadaffi Ave. with no consultation with Banjul City Council, ensuring that proper procedures were followed in the adoption of street names. It was the time when Atlantic hotel was sold.
Political democracy is very new in Africa and we are still learning. Darboe's phone call conceding defeat was the first for a major opposition party since our political evolution. I cannot remember anytime when Sheriff ever called Jawara conceding defeat. If people have to be angry, then they should angry with themselves for not voting for the opposition. It’s that simple because if they did APRC would now be a minority party in the House.
So for now, the choice of the people is APRC and that has to be respected. Democracy is about patience and selling your ideas to the electorate. The best sales man makes the most sales and therefore the best party wins the majority votes and forms a government.
Darboe has only one vote just like you and me. If we did not vote for him, he cannot force his way to statehouse. That will be treasonable act, I will be more than happy to defend the constitution by volunteering in a civil defense force to preserve and protect multiparty democracy with all the teething problems we have at the moment.
Don’t get me wrong. Citizens have a right to associate with any a party but they also have a right to not associate at all in a democracy. But they should understand, either way, they are directly or indirectly influencing their political destinies.
And that’s why, Citizens have responsibilities and that society has agreed that any one who is qualified to vote, is of a sound mind and judgment to be able to desire the very best for his community. Anything short of that, is a betrayal of trust of that society.
If you want to see change vote. By staying away, we all helped to maintain the status quo. The low turnout in the last election only increased the influence of the APRC. The right to not associate was exercised by Gambians but at a price. For every action, there is an equal opposite reaction (Physic 101)
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“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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BambaLaye
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 20:46:45
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Kondorongo:
You do have a cute way of dogding the bullet so to speak. I respectfully decline to get into a discussion on the merits or lack thereof of Darboe's political activities/decisions. I respectfully conclude he is a spent force and thus not worth the time and effort. I know Demba will not like this but I honestly think it is futile to talk about Darboe's potency as if he has any clout left to dictate the political future of Gambia - my opinion. Granted we could all learn from the numerous blunders he made time and time again (I refuse to revisit historical specifics as I know you very well know what I know about his political actions in the past 12 or so years).
BTW, the emperor portrayed wisdom in his quote and it very well applies to numerous political, social or economic situations in Africa today. For that I adore him. Like you, I also abhor his human rights records. Unfortunately I cannot quote Jammeh for he has no wisdom tooth - I mean wisdom. He is a true retard!
Enjoy your day. |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 21:10:45
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quote:
Originally posted by BambaLaye
Kondorongo:
You do have a cute way of dogding the bullet so to speak. I respectfully decline to get into a discussion on the merits or lack thereof of Darboe's political activities/decisions. .......
You have a right to feel the way you feel with Darboe, but so are hundreds of thousands of Gambians who are ready to support the man. As to whether he is a spent force depends of which side of history you stood when the country needed its citzens to exercise a sacred duty of casting a vote.
Furthermore, there are hundreds of thousands who are voting for Jammeh. This is why i like democracy. Its the will of the people that determines who leads. As to whether the leader is good or bad is a moral judgement which unfortunately has no place in a democracy. Democracy assumes that a government elected by the people is a constituted authority and therfore legitimate. The safeguard is if the citizens are not satisfied, they can change the government even before the next election through a an impeachment by atleast 2/3 of the National Assembly; or they may vote and change at the expiry of a term. It looks like APRC is voted in and out three times.
What this tells me is that the majority still look up to APRC as the party of choice.
Jammeh ofcourse has said somethings that have wisdom. Didnt you hear of the Three Days Wisdom- Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow? Even Jaliba Kuyateh had a song about it and with all respect, the wisdom that Jammeh said regarding the three days is food for thought for every one. Although i am not sure if Jammeh actually thinks he could learn from it. Thats the sad part of his wisdom. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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Ousman
USA
103 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 21:28:51
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BambaLaye wrote:
I respectfully conclude he is a spent force and thus not worth the time and effort. I know Demba will not like this but I honestly think it is futile to talk about Darboe's potency as if he has any clout left to dictate the political future of Gambia - my opinion.
I share your agony on the miss opportunity that was the last election and the role that Darboe and other leaders have played in that turmoil. However I beg to disagree with your characterization that he is a spent force. Gambian politics is pardon the phrase "cultist"...based on personalities. UDP has become synonymous with Ousainou. And unless you want to further your argument to the UDP's irrelevancy in Gambian politics, I would advice caution in tagging Darboe a spent force. But yet again you've made it clear that this is your opinion. |
http://Gambian.blogspot.com |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 23:07:35
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Is UDP about a United Democractic Party or own by my lord! Lawyer Ousainou Darboe and politics of personalities Is Darboe for life Presidential candidate of UDP
What a stumbling block 
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Edited by - kobo on 25 Oct 2007 23:11:05 |
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BambaLaye
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 23:20:25
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I feel obliged to clarify my feather ruffling characterization of Darboe's political force as being spent. (1)By virtue of the constitution - unless this has been changed or that I am wrong about Darboe's age - he cannot contest elections in 2011. Accordingly, the constitution states thus in reference to qualifications to be elected president: (b) he or she has attained the minimum age of thirty years but not more than sixty-five years;
(2) I do agree and very much believe UDP has become synonymous with Darboe and thus he has become more of a liability to UDP than ever - just look at the trend of overall votes for UDP from 1996/97 elections to the last year - in that his and UDP’s support is has been taking a nose dive over the years.
(3)The NADD scar will take ages (unfortunately, he does not have as many politically viable years left to work with see (1) above)to heal such that he can get back his pre-NADD, pre-coalition support base. In fact, this may be impossible for him at this point.
Thus, my conclusion Darboe is a politically spent force. I made it clear we can benefit from his blunders and wisdom in law; granted.
It's been a long day for me so pardon my brevity and this will be it on Darboe (the spent force).
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 23:26:06
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quote:
Originally posted by kobo
Is UDP about a United Democractic Party or own by my lord! Lawyer Ousainou Darboe and politics of personalities Is Darboe for life Presidential candidate of UDP
What a stumbling block
Darboe is the leader of UDP. That does not make him a ".. life presidential candidate of UDP" if i may quote you. Until his party chooses someone else, he remains relevant. Leadership is about showing the way and as the leader of his party, you cannot seperate him and the party.
Leadership is about commitment too. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 23:30:25
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Tell me a brief overview of how UDP was form? Where was it launched and when if you have some information please? How was Darboe originally selected as party leader? What was the criteria or his POLITICAL credential to hand him the party leadership?
I can assure you I blindly supported him (i.e SO EAGER FOR CHANGE OF THE SYSTEM!) and casted my VOTES for him whenever he contests the elections as Presidential candidate (except time of his/UDP boycout!). That can be translated that I am UDP supporter 100% since existence.
Anyone can share information with us |
Edited by - kobo on 25 Oct 2007 23:39:06 |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 23:35:05
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Every party selects a cnadidate who they believe can win. Its that simple.
UDP was formed after the lifting of the ban on political activities just like all parties. Those who want to seek office put themselves forward, organise themselves and register a party just like PDOIS, APRC, NDAM, etc.
There is nothing magical about formation of UDP. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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