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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
 Posted - 12 Sep 2007 : 17:00:58
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Serenata did you watch the documentary/news about HALIBURTON! Thats OIL on World's second largest reserves!. The pipeline project covered Russia, Afghan, Iraq to Saudi Arabia.
Thats why Dick Cheyne always smiling when delivering speeches. |
Edited by - kobo on 12 Sep 2007 17:01:58 |
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serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 12 Sep 2007 : 18:02:59
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| Thanks, Kobo. There are so many documentaries about the so-called 'War On Terror'™ and its real background; I can't count all I saw. E.g. the German TV station WDR produced some excellent documentaries. But maybe it is not allowed to show them in Bush's USA. People in the USA seem to be terribly uninformed/brainwashed about their governments' foreign policy. |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 12 Sep 2007 : 19:42:36
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Serenata 9/11 was a TRAGEDY which has great impact in the world order. There were high level politics on Middle East and Gulf States, mafia (Big Corporations) and underworld agencies (C.I.A, K.G.B, MOSAD, In-Ti-Faada, "Al-Quaida" etc) that culminate in that TERROR AND COUNTER-TERRORISM.
Politics has shifted in dividing the world further based on religion. Now Muslism are the victims and Bin Laden is capitalising on that to justify his course. The world is not safe and any attempt to disscuss these issues openly may land you in trouble. There are these terms of "fanatism", "extremism", "glorification", "jihad", "crusade" etc etc. ISLAM THOUGH IS NOT ABOUT WAR OR POLITICS BUT A RELIGION OF PEACE! They should leave the muslims pray in their mosques. The Imams should not gave sermons about POLITICS, castigating West, US, Jews, Infidels etc. Likewise The Pope and Rabbies should not indulge in POLITICS AND DIVISION OF THE HUMAN RACE! Islam's message is for "Ya Bani Adam!" (Oh ye children of Adam!) and is not own by the Arabs or any RACE! The message in Islam is for ALL MANKIND to follow under ONE GOD ("ALLAH!") without any compulsion! We all have FREEDOM OF CHOICE & CONVICTION.
Courtesy of Turk; "So stop shooting the messenger. Focus on the message!"I share with you the last sermon of The holy Prophet Muhamad (s.a.w) under http://www.whyislam.org/877/Last_Prophet/Last_Sermon.asp
One has to be carefull about topics involving Bin Laden as they say that: "The NET is cast wide open".
The coming of "Dajaal!" was a prophecy Cyberspace is controlled through ONE EYE! |
Edited by - kobo on 13 Sep 2007 01:23:53 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 00:10:23
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The man is death. Who killed him? The movie is about the man's death. The detective investigation starts ask the million dollar question. Who gets the most benefit of this death? That is probably the one who is guilty.
I mean war on terrorism. Why there is a terrorism? I mean it is not that muslims will invade the west. We neither have money, nor weapons or media power to do that. As an ideology islam is not even close to compete with west. We can't beat them in typical war. We can't take over their economies. Oh terrorism. Why there is terrorism. But most important, the million dollar question who gets the most benefit from the terrorism in terms who is getting more who is losing more.
What west lose? Up to 5000 people death.
What muslims gain? Nothing. Nada. Zilc. Zero. Nothing. Emptiness.
What west gain? They settled one of the most strategic point in central asia. Afghanistan has tremendous political importance. They are between China, Pakistan, India and most important oil, may I repeat, 'oil', come on everybody repeat after me 'oil' and natural gas geography, central asia. What else. They settle in iraq. They divide and rule iraq. Come on united and stronger iraq with Saddam was more dangerous against the oil politics and threat to Israel. Now they occupied iraq. It is divided. No more strenght to be potentially dangerous to israel. Now they have base in Kurdistan to attack iran for israel soldiers. Now israelis train the kurdish army who is socialist, ateist forces (very convenient ally for westerners). What else. They are selling a lots of weapons to devilish regime like saudi arabia.
What we lost. WHat muslims lost. Kafeer settled in gulf. In our holy land. No "kafeeeer" is supposed to be in this land of our prophet. Why are there in our holy land. To embarres us. To humiliate us. Most important. TO PROVOKE US. They want us to be terrorist. Because our terrorist actions provide benefits to them. This is what we lost. Thousands of muslim deaths. We are subject to racial profiling everyday at immigration, school work. Double standards for human rights. They can insult our prophets with cartoon to provoke us even more. So. In summary. Who gets the most from the 'islamic terrorism'. That one has the most guilt.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 01:34:47
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Sorry Turk! Don't aggravate matters please All is POLITICS AND NOT ABOUT IDEOLOGY. Its COMPETITION for domination, exploitation of resources and materialism. If muslims are mentioned that can be considered absurd SEGREGATION as muslims and those embracing ISLAM are all over the world (East, West, North & south). I cannot describe that kind of discrimination as RACISM because all races are with muslims. Its hard to alienate muslims but we have very naive muslims that are using ISLAM in politics. 9/11 and Bin Laden are really torns in the flesh of muslims and against its religion (ISLAM). Enemies of this great religion of ISLAM are using that terror as weapons against it for condemnation and other POLITICS. All these troubles in making this world very dangerous are caused by the political wrangles in the Middle East & Gulf States and boosted by PREACHINGS OF HATE!. HATRED IS REALLY BAD! Isn't itMuslims are really losing the battle POLITICALLY ( because thats not what the religion is for); but Allah is protecting its religion as there are millions converting and embracing ISLAM (for its MESSAGE TO MANKIND!). Ignore the POLITICS AND PROVOCATIONS and be humble with youself to lead a normal life, follow your religion privately and allow others to do the same.I refer you back to the last sermon of Prophet Muhamad to REFLECT UPON FOR WISDOM & PEACE!
The Gulf and Middle East are not for muslims alone. The EARTH belongs to MANKIND! Its sensible to settle anywhere in the world. Damarcations, leasing and tenancy are all capitalism and materalism. Lets be humble with living in tents and to easily shift our tents when we want to settle TEMPORARILY. Lets built bridges and open the borders for everyone to live in TOLERANCE, PEACE, PROSPERITY & HARMONY!
ISLAM IS FOR ALL CHILDREN OF ADAM! |
Edited by - kobo on 13 Sep 2007 02:24:27 |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 08:05:23
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quote:
Originally posted by serenata
Kayjatta, I respect your love for your country. But sometimes I am surprised to see how naive even intelligent, educated people can be at certain points.
If it was not organized by the US government itself, 9/11 at least came as a big relief for Bush. Please try to remember: After the flagrant electoral fraud which made him president, Bush's reputation in the US and in the world was below zero. He didn't improve as a president; inter alia he was critized for being lazy. His presidency was nothing but a big embarrassment.
Then, bang! - 9/11! The assassination was not only the perfect pretence for the occupation of Afghanistan and Iraq (which was planned long before 9/11, as we know now) - it saved Bush's bacon. He could play the successful crisis manager, nobody dared to criticize him any longer. THE NATION WAS ON WAR! Right or wrong, my president...
So, if Bin Laden is really responsible for 9/11, Bush, the US oil industry, the US weapon industry, army suppliers, private security companies, etc. etc. must be very, very grateful to him. He made their decade, maybe their century. He let them make money, money, money. I am sure they love him.
War on Terror. Good joke. Haha.
Serenata , I am a Gambian (yirikuntu si meh bato bara ti kela bambo ti , you can ask Kondorong or Santafara for the explanation). I am not even a big supporter of George Bush's presidency. I am more on the Democratic side of the American political spectrum. Yet even if I do not support Bush as a president (which is a separate matter completely) my conscience and principles of life cannot allow me sympathise with terrorists. Terrorists have no respect for human life . When they blow up a subway system in London or Paris or Hamburg , they do not care whether you and I or Santafara gets killed. They know they cannot win any military war , so they can only make a political statement by killing innocent people. They do not even share our world view , they believe in a seventh century world view , that stifles reasoning and human freedom including gender equality. We are witnessing a new wave of terrorism. Do you remember the bombings and airplane hijackings of the 1980s ? How about Lockebie ? You see terrorism has been with us for a while (it is not invented by Bush  ) , but it has taken up a new and more dangerous dimension now. With the collapse of the USSR , improvements in communication and the increased risk of proliferation of chemical , biological and nuclear weapons , terrorism poses a greater danger to world peace than ever before.
You seem to suggest that 911 was orchestrated by U.S.against itself ? That is so farfetched I wonder any sane person can adhere to that in the face of all the facts to the contrary. Do you have any evidence that 911 was organized by Americans ? Do you know about Muhammed Atta and others , and the paper trail they left behind ?
But you are right that 911 offered Bush an opportunity to galvanize support both at home and abroad ( and he capitalized on that opportunity but mishandled it later thereby losing much of the original support), yet who would not ?
By the way Bin Laden is pretty brushed up in his latest video , did he have a makeover  ? I mean the beard is dyed and his cheeks are pumped up..., you know for a single guy living in a cave do you need all that...? |
Edited by - kayjatta on 13 Sep 2007 08:07:48 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 08:10:24
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Sorry sister kobo
I did not get your point. Or perhaps you did not get my point. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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Alhassan
Sweden
813 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 08:56:59
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quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
Serenata , I am a Gambian (yirikuntu si meh bato bara ti kela bambo ti , you can ask Kondorong or Santafara for the explanation). I am not even a big supporter of George Bush's presidency. I am more on the Democratic side of the American political spectrum. Yet even if I do not support Bush as a president (which is a separate matter completely) my conscience and principles of life cannot allow me sympathise with terrorists. Terrorists have no respect for human life . When they blow up a subway system in London or Paris or Hamburg , they do not care whether you and I or Santafara gets killed. They know they cannot win any military war , so they can only make a political statement by killing innocent people. They do not even share our world view , they believe in a seventh century world view , that stifles reasoning and human freedom including gender equality. We are witnessing a new wave of terrorism. Do you remember the bombings and airplane hijackings of the 1980s ? How about Lockebie ? You see terrorism has been with us for a while (it is not invented by Bush ) , but it has taken up a new and more dangerous dimension now. With the collapse of the USSR , improvements in communication and the increased risk of proliferation of chemical , biological and nuclear weapons , terrorism poses a greater danger to world peace than ever before.
You seem to suggest that 911 was orchestrated by U.S.against itself ? That is so farfetched I wonder any sane person can adhere to that in the face of all the facts to the contrary. Do you have any evidence that 911 was organized by Americans ? Do you know about Muhammed Atta and others , and the paper trail they left behind ?
But you are right that 911 offered Bush an opportunity to galvanize support both at home and abroad ( and he capitalized on that opportunity but mishandled it later thereby losing much of the original support), yet who would not ?
By the way Bin Laden is pretty brushed up in his latest video , did he have a makeover ? I mean the beard is dyed and his cheeks are pumped up..., you know for a single guy living in a cave do you need all that...?
kayjatta,
Do you support the war against Irak or Afganistan? Remember the US created Al-Quaida. Is the socalled war against Muslims in other parts of the world justified? What has Gambia gained in supporting Bush? Is Irak better today ? Is there freedom and democracy in Irak today?
Bro, I do not share the same opinion as some of the Yankees when it comes to the problem in the Middle East. I am sorry but I have a whole bunch of questions for you to answer. It is a pity that we live so far away. I have nothing against the vedio because inocent people die every day in the Middle East because of Bush and his allies. Today I heard over the radio that the antiwar movement in the Us have printed some posters against the war in Irak but the Republicans call it a violation of freedom of expresson, because the anti war movement see the problem differently. They want their children, husbands, wives ect out of Irak but niot Bush.
Although I am not from the Middle East, IMy heart is with them every moment of my live. If I was to decide, I will throw out all US troops and their allies from their. Gambia gains nothing, instead she gets setbacks because all the focus is in the Middle East. A big wastage of funds when people are hungry all over the world.
I cannot see the symphaty the Us and their allies have on thew human race. Their own people are suffering and ding every minute, but a lot of funds is wasted on unneccessary weapons. I think Putin was right to point fingers at countries arround Russia who allow the US to place missels in their countries. Is the situation in Palistine just now ok for you? |
Edited by - Alhassan on 13 Sep 2007 09:06:21 |
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Sibo
Denmark
231 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 09:27:08
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I am against terrorism as most poeple are, I hate violence in gereral. And I think it is ok to fight terrorism. What is not ok is the fact that many people today connects ISLAM with terrorism. There are people of other religions who are terrorists as well. The Irish and the spanish terrorist groups, the Isrealis invading the palestinian settlements, thats terrorisme as well. And not to mention how aparthied terrorised black south africans for decades. How come nobody is talking and fighting these terrorists?????
On the other hand I blame moslem who are killing innocent people in the name of Islam. Islam is a very peacefull religion and Allah is not asking anybody to kill in his name. So these people should stop killing in the name of Allah |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 09:29:43
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Alhassan:
We have to find terrorists where ever they are. We had to invade Afghanistan to uproot Bin Laden and his Taliban host. Iraq is a little different. The war in Iraq was built on faulty intelligence. If we had known what we know today U.S. would not have invaded Iraq. But to err is human , and now that we are there we must do everything possible to help Iraqis establish an all inclusive democracy for all of its people. We cannot allow Al-Qaeda to set up a home in Iraq , or allow Iran or Syria to have a surrogate state there. Gambia does not have to gain anything specific from supporting Bush , but it can have confidence and satisfaction by belonging to a community of people who stand for justice, truth , and beauty.There are dissenting views in America as far as the war is concerned , but the beauty of America is the fact that everyone is free to express their opinion , and America is the best critic of itself. Funny isn't it ? I share your frustration over the war in Iraq but the biggest mistake you , Serenata , Santafara and many others are making is by trading your criticism for the Iraq war for support of Al-Qaeda and terrorism. I cannot see any rationality in defending terrorists who would not think twice to kill you and I...
I will post one of my poems here so you can see how I criticized this war somewhere else. |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 09:31:47
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quote:
Originally posted by turk
Sorry sister kobo
I did not get your point. Or perhaps you did not get my point.
You don't see my points. What am pointing out are:
1) that this politics is not about religious ideology, because you were wrong to stated in quotes "As an ideology islam is not even close to compete with west. We can't beat them in typical war. We can't take over their economies.". Please note that you appear to single out ISLAM as an isolated religion from other religions and the sole competitor with your so-called West(tern political ideology!).
2) To elaborate further that this war on so-called terror is not between West(tern ideology) and ISLAM. Thats why I stated that "Politics has shifted in dividing the world further based on religion. Now Muslism are the victims and Bin Laden is capitalising on that to justify his course."
3)You also stated that "What west gain? They settled one of the most strategic point in central asia. Afghanistan has tremendous political importance. They are between China, Pakistan, India and most important oil, may I repeat, 'oil', come on everybody repeat after me 'oil' and natural gas geography, central asia. What else. They settle in iraq. They divide and rule iraq."
4) Then my comments follows that "All is POLITICS AND NOT ABOUT IDEOLOGY. Its COMPETITION for domination, exploitation of resources and materialism. Therefore we are in agreement on Points 3) & 4) that it is all about POLITICS OF OIL!
5) Finally I stated that"If muslims are mentioned that can be considered absurd SEGREGATION as muslims and those embracing ISLAM are all over the world (East, West, North & south). I cannot describe that kind of discrimination as RACISM because all races are with muslims.Therefore Turk ISLAM (as a religious ideology)and MUSLIMS (its BELIEVERS) are not the ADVERSARY but is being exploited for POLITICS AND DIS-ORIENTAION by its ENEMIES! We understand that the muslims are highly concentrated in Middle East & Gulf; with vast resources and holy monuments. There are other non-muslims that originated there also.
Hope I made my points clear to you |
Edited by - kobo on 13 Sep 2007 09:39:18 |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 09:34:25
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WAR AND PEACE :
KAYJATTA.
If man may go to war
It must be for peace
How could Musharaf ' ve said more eloquently?
When generals rise and fall
War and peace
That Van Der Waals hearts of men
Like day and night
When we wake up to a better day
For peace is a better day
From a night of slumber
This war is a thousand times misunderstood
The longer we stay the bigger the fallout
When was it from jihadists and insurgents to rejectionists?
Rummy's weapons for Dicken's words
Now they sent you to war
Treacherous wind across the desert , fierce
Shiites tugged at one front
Sunnis waging, religion weaponized
Further than Nigeria
Now we lost our men
Body bags hugged by pale loved ones
Who know not where Iraq is , not even on a map
Where a foot soldier patrols a deadly night
Knowing he 's making a better day
For peace is a better day .
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 09:38:51
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THEY CAMPED IN CRAWFORD , TEXAS :
KAYJATTA.
They camped in Crawford , Texas
Voices resonating a crowd
Marched through the Capitol
Does anyone care ?
If there are people in Washington
Who think Iraq 's the great call
Let Cindy Sheehan tell you
There 's no catching up
For Archilles and the tortoise
Who shall be condemned
For getting weary of this war ?
Even if there 're people on the Capitol
Who think Iraq 's the calling of the time
Here 's a body of peace
Resonating a crowd
They camped in Crawford , Texas
We 've won this war
But lost everything else
And there 's no catching up
But none 're misled
That evil incarnated the tyrant
Now we know Iraq's a Pandora's box
That the devil brutally kept the lid on
Let Cindy Sheehan tell you
There 's no catching up
And none shall be condemned
For getting weary of this war
Hope these guys tire of this sh...
And start living not dying.
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 09:40:45
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| I hope those two show to you that there is a difference being critical of this war and supporting terrorists... |
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Alhassan
Sweden
813 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2007 : 11:53:41
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quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
Alhassan:
We have to find terrorists where ever they are. We had to invade Afghanistan to uproot Bin Laden and his Taliban host. Iraq is a little different. The war in Iraq was built on faulty intelligence. If we had known what we know today U.S. would not have invaded Iraq. But to err is human , and now that we are there we must do everything possible to help Iraqis establish an all inclusive democracy for all of its people. We cannot allow Al-Qaeda to set up a home in Iraq , or allow Iran or Syria to have a surrogate state there. Gambia does not have to gain anything specific from supporting Bush , but it can have confidence and satisfaction by belonging to a community of people who stand for justice, truth , and beauty.There are dissenting views in America as far as the war is concerned , but the beauty of America is the fact that everyone is free to express their opinion , and America is the best critic of itself. Funny isn't it ? I share your frustration over the war in Iraq but the biggest mistake you , Serenata , Santafara and many others are making is by trading your criticism for the Iraq war for support of Al-Qaeda and terrorism. I cannot see any rationality in defending terrorists who would not think twice to kill you and I...
I will post one of my poems here so you can see how I criticized this war somewhere else.
kayjatta,
I am not impressed by the US at all. I do not even want to travel or have something to do with them because of the maner they treat other people. Yankees are not fit to be part of the world because they are all hippocrits. I would not mind to loose my live as the bombers did to get rid of them on the map.There are Christian extrimists in America with the white Bible. They say that Black race is inferior to the white. George Bush is a member like wise many others who apppear in false manars. The Yankees protect these people never mind what ever they do. I know you are pro American. The problem withn the muslims in Irak, Afganistan, Palistine, Libanon and most Arab countries is because of the corrupt lobbyist from the US.Without their intefearence these people vill live in harmony. I have tried to travel to these place to see for myself, and have an opinion. Is the division of Gaza from Palistine justified? To the Yankees it is ok because they still would divide and rule. Have you visited any refuegee camp in the Middle East yet? If not try so that you will not depend on the news behind the news feed by the Us journalists.
The next action will be bigger and felt more than 9/11. |
Edited by - Alhassan on 13 Sep 2007 11:57:02 |
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