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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
 Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 21:19:36
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http://www.thepoint.gm/headlines2234.htm
in my personal view, an emphatic "YES", it does.
in weighing my arguement, here is a 'sinless' and 'sinful' nafs (souls) being compared. before birth, you are a saint.
well, cannot be disputed that a one day old blood cloth, equals a baby, equals a human, equals to everyone else.
there, some medics will argue some 'abortions' being done for health reasons, but the latest of abortions under gambian culture is to run away from the shame of unplanned pregnancies or illegitimate children.
therefore, baby dumping = abortion= murder
another of the hateful practice, baby dumping. it makes me truly vomit rage.
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"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 21:45:15
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| Is abrotion murder?It depends on many factors. Religious belief, age of the fetus etc. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 22:00:45
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I am not sure it is 'categorically murder act' but I am against abortion. While there may be cases, for example, a few days ago one of my co-workers told me they had to terminate the baby because ultrasound shown that baby was not growing properly, you can't really oppose the termination in that case. Or pregnancy due to rape or sexual abuse by relatives, family members. In terms of Islam, if a man and a woman got married it is normal process to get baby. However, if baby is unwanted because there is no comitment, because someone got pregnant because of one night stand, you don't follow islam first place you had sex without holy marriage. So terminating pregnancy in that case, one is correcting one mistake with another mistake. So it is wrong.
So I would not called it murder, maybe third degree murder!! :) |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 22:12:56
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quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
Is abrotion murder?It depends on many factors. Religious belief, age of the fetus etc.
Kons, you are welcome to explain more. cos how would age of 'fetus' determine it not being murder? are you referencing the man-made flawed laws or true law of nature.
Turks,
i totally agree with your explaination, just to add, it is category 1st degree murder. infact, very common to the mistake you pointed. one wrong to rectify another wrong. isn't it a soul anyway?? |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 23:46:46
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| the farakan speech will make sense here in his million man march. abortion is equal murder but some circumstances it may be allowed like when the mothers life will be at risk or in cases of rape etc. this is my personal opinion but a scholarly one may be necessary. |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 00:23:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalton1
quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
Is abrotion murder?It depends on many factors. Religious belief, age of the fetus etc.
Kons, you are welcome to explain more. cos how would age of 'fetus' determine it not being murder? are you referencing the man-made flawed laws or true law of nature.
Turks,
i totally agree with your explaination, just to add, it is category 1st degree murder. infact, very common to the mistake you pointed. one wrong to rectify another wrong. isn't it a soul anyway??
Of all the religions, only islam has established at what age of the fetus is it considerd to have life or in short considered human. There was an international conference on this attended by many learned persons including scientists and theologians. This was year back. I can remeber the specifics now. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 00:27:32
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kons. & Uncle santa,
thank you both for ur rejoinders. probably, i was speaking with impulse, and with true rage. 
let justice preside over their case.
Dalton |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 00:32:01
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Dalton
The reason why islam provides for a divorced woman to keep to herself for 3 months and 10 days is to establish a pregnancy. At 3 months 10 days, many important physiological organs begin to take shape. After this date, its murder. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
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Lily
United Kingdom
422 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 00:33:24
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I think this is a very emotive topic and one that should be approached with care.
For myself, I don't regard abortion as murder - but i fully appreciate that some people may.
I do, I'm afraid, respect a woman's right to choose. There are religious considerations, moral consideratons and practical considerations (and the rights of the father too). I don't think
(m)any women have an abortion lightly.
Some believe that life begins when you take a breath.
Others kill freely in (somehow) justified wars
What is murder - exactly?
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 04:43:26
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Maybe abortion is only allowed if following happens.
1. Only women apply a council of
- Judge
- Imam, Priest, rabbi (not voting right)
- Doctor
Women and her lawyer present the case and evidence for abortion if both judge and doctor approves abortion would be allowed. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 07:24:52
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| I am a pro-choice . I believe that women should have complete control over their reproductive lives. However , late term abortion should be restricted. |
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Sibo
Denmark
231 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 09:02:12
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Is abortion illegal in Gambia?????
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 09:20:30
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Kayjatta I love you! 
As I have posted before your wife and children are very lucky to have you.
I am pro choice. The choice is the WOMENS. Obviously in a relationship the women should consider the mans opinion, but it is NOTHING to do with priests, politicians, lawyers etc.
Women in UK used to risk their lives having 'back street' abortions. Now they can have them safely in hospitals.
Abortion can have emotional and physical consequences and shouldnt be taken lightly.
It shouldnt be considered alternative contraception. Women have many choices with contraception and abortions should be used when this has FAILED, not jusy out of laziness.
I do think 'life' starts very early. I do think we are killing a 'being' with abortion. BUT I am still in favour of choice and still in favour of the act of abortion because I would like EVERY CHILD to be WANTED and LOVED.
In the UK abortions go on to 24 weeks. I personally think this is late and there is a move to reduce the number of weeks. When babies are becoming increasingly viable at earlier stages I think the abortion time scales needs to be reduced.
I am in the lucky position of never needing an abortion. But I do believe in the right of other women to have the choice and to control their own bodies.
I did have a miscarriage at 13 weeks. It was a much wanted baby. To me it was 'alive' inside me and then it died. At 13 weeks I had all the hopes and dreams of being happily pregnant and it felt like a very real death.
This experience made me very glad I had never had an abortion. But it didnt alter my belief in the rights of the individual women. |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 09:42:27
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Thanks Bev. Love you too . I have stated in one of my unpublished poems that " abortion is not wrong , the events that lead to it are wrong". And what I mean is that abortion should be considered in the broad socio-economic context. People do not do abortion out of pleasure ; if many of the ills in our society such as poverty , gender inequality , poor education , etc are contained there will be less need for abortion.
"She who feels it knows it". |
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Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 11:07:17
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quote:
Originally posted by kayjatta
Thanks Bev. Love you too . I have stated in one of my unpublished poems that " abortion is not wrong , the events that lead to it are wrong". And what I mean is that abortion should be considered in the broad socio-economic context. People do not do abortion out of pleasure ; if many of the ills in our society such as poverty , gender inequality , poor education , etc are contained there will be less need for abortion.
"She who feels it knows it".
you two are comfusing issues here .no one is against the right of the woman .but every individual need to take responsibility for his or her own actions. imagine if you where aborted ,what choice did you have ? it is not just about the mother here but also about the baby .look at it in that direction also.all the time we tend to be over emotional when women issues are concern but what about the baby being killed by a mother .in days gone one can arque the choises but now women have thausand and one choise not to get pregnant . |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
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kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2007 : 11:43:33
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| Abortion should be legal , accessible and sparingly used.We are talking about living women with flesh and blood and feelings. What baby are you talking about , Santafara ? |
Edited by - kayjatta on 22 Aug 2007 11:45:05 |
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