 |
|
| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Santanfara
3460 Posts |
 Posted - 24 May 2007 : 13:34:38
|
i confess openly not to like the style of leadership of our ex-president dk jawara . i was phone by a very close friend of mine from england this morning and our discussions centre arround BB Darboes interview in the www.thegambiaecho.com . i didn't read the interview so i couldn't make any comments .during our talk he brough in some things ex-president jawara went through during his last days in england .
the man suffered a lot he said. jawara was broke completely financailly and morally . he was not as corrupt as many puts it .i was surprise at that statement . but my own experience with a nigerian embassy senior staff in 2005 in wembley england ,a guy by the name of captain . this man was a former pilot who later took up a job in nigerian embassy in england. he once told me how broke jawara was ,and i told him i don't care .he said ''obasanjo the x-presiendt of nigeria authorise them to give a cheque of $70000 to jawara because the man's u.k house was up for repossassion by his bank for failed morgage payments. that did affect me . so if jawara was that broke can we savely assume that his corruption level wasn't as bad as we are made to believe. this was the reason why jawara took up the offer by yahya to return back to the gambia .the man nearly went mad with saddness and hardship .he uses his personal income to try to mobilise the international communittee to help him return to power .he even paid lawyers for advice on how to be reinstated .this causes his finacial nightmare .saddly also his children where no were to be seen during the fathers time of need .
what can we deduce from jawara's legacy ? one i will say let's train our children on meaningful things and hardwork .many ex-ministers children came to there aid ,but why not jawara ? he shouldn't have been left expose like he did if his children stood there ground and acted like proper men/women. i now soften my critism of jawara .the man was not a bigger thief as i assume .he fail us for sure .
|
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
|
|
mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2007 : 15:10:56
|
Brother Santa, I think the answers to your questions lies right in there in your piece. Jawara was corrupt and he became broke by spending the very money he stole to make a come back. Even if he was not corrupt at the level that you think, he oversaw a system where his henchmen plundered our nation. So he is equally culpabale if not more.
|
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
 |
|
|
mansasulu
997 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2007 : 15:10:56
|
Brother Santa, I think the answers to your questions lies right in there in your piece. Jawara was corrupt and he became broke by spending the very money he stole to make a come back. Even if he was not corrupt at the level that you think, he oversaw a system where his henchmen plundered our nation. So he is equally culpabale if not more.
|
"...Verily, in the remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad (Chapter 13, Verse 28)
...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... |
|
|
|
Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 00:32:55
|
quote:
Originally posted by mansasulu
Brother Santa, I think the answers to your questions lies right in there in your piece. Jawara was corrupt and he became broke by spending the very money he stole to make a come back. Even if he was not corrupt at the level that you think, he oversaw a system where his henchmen plundered our nation. So he is equally culpabale if not more.
i aggree mansa , he too took part .the favouritism . |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
|
|
|
Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 00:32:55
|
quote:
Originally posted by mansasulu
Brother Santa, I think the answers to your questions lies right in there in your piece. Jawara was corrupt and he became broke by spending the very money he stole to make a come back. Even if he was not corrupt at the level that you think, he oversaw a system where his henchmen plundered our nation. So he is equally culpabale if not more.
i aggree mansa , he too took part .the favouritism . |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
|
|
|
BornAfrican
United Kingdom
119 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 05:52:04
|
Santanfara:
so if jawara was that broke can we savely assume that his corruption level wasn't as bad as we are made to believe. this was the reason why jawara took up the offer by yahya to return back to the gambia .the man nearly went mad with saddness and hardship .he uses his personal income to try to mobilise the international communittee to help him return to power .he even paid lawyers for advice on how to be reinstated .this causes his finacial nightmare .saddly also his children where no were to be seen during the fathers time of need
he shouldn't have been left expose like he did if his children stood there ground and acted like proper men/women. i now soften my critism of jawara .the man was not a bigger thief as i assume .he fail us for sure .
BornAfrican:
Its quite late, its 4:30 in the morning, but i believe i'm obliged to do justice to this subject; as a result, i have to respond to your posting before i go to bed.
If Hitler had lived to see his legacy, it would have been good. the irony about Hitler's whole issue is his mysterious death almost at the end of the war. I am not comparing Jawara to Hitler because i know that Hitler for sure is better than him and 99% of African leaders. Why did i say so? Hitler had a vision for his people. African leaders including Jawara had and have no vision for their people. Their horizon has always been and is as limited as the eyesight of a bat in the daylight.
I am very happy to see Jawara live to live his own legacy. I think you should have been calling for his indictment to the Hague for the crimes he committed against the Gambians. Jawara architected this system. as the old saying goes: "as you make your bed, you must lie on it". Bruv Santangfara, the only wish i have for Jawara right now is a longer life so that he can reap the benefits of his legacy to the maximum.
Why did Jawara buy that house in England in the first place? Why couldn't he have built that house in the Gambia so that when he retires he lives in there. He knew the system he created could only favor him while he was in power.
"the man was not a bigger thief as i assume" i quote you.
Jawara was more than a "bigger" thief. Jawara refused to educate the Gambian child. He created an "information-poor" society where the few informed people will rule till kingdom come. Does anyone remember when Jawara told Gambians that the kind of politics PDOIS preaches, if they succeed, no one will even own his wife? He told Gambians that with socialism, you have to share everything including your wife. He was playing his cards well and playing the game cool. He knew what ever nonsense he spews out to the public, it would be absorbed because thats the kind of society he created.
I need to go to sleep now, but please, Jawara deserves no sympathy. In today's Gambia under Yaya, evil overrides good and thank god he spared Jawara's life to walk this long rough and raggedy green mile with the rest of us. |
me |
Edited by - BornAfrican on 25 May 2007 15:27:38 |
|
|
|
BornAfrican
United Kingdom
119 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 05:52:04
|
Santanfara:
so if jawara was that broke can we savely assume that his corruption level wasn't as bad as we are made to believe. this was the reason why jawara took up the offer by yahya to return back to the gambia .the man nearly went mad with saddness and hardship .he uses his personal income to try to mobilise the international communittee to help him return to power .he even paid lawyers for advice on how to be reinstated .this causes his finacial nightmare .saddly also his children where no were to be seen during the fathers time of need
he shouldn't have been left expose like he did if his children stood there ground and acted like proper men/women. i now soften my critism of jawara .the man was not a bigger thief as i assume .he fail us for sure .
BornAfrican:
Its quite late, its 4:30 in the morning, but i believe i'm obliged to do justice to this subject; as a result, i have to respond to your posting before i go to bed.
If Hitler had lived to see his legacy, it would have been good. the irony about Hitler's whole issue is his mysterious death almost at the end of the war. I am not comparing Jawara to Hitler because i know that Hitler for sure is better than him and 99% of African leaders. Why did i say so? Hitler had a vision for his people. African leaders including Jawara had and have no vision for their people. Their horizon has always been and is as limited as the eyesight of a bat in the daylight.
I am very happy to see Jawara live to live his own legacy. I think you should have been calling for his indictment to the Hague for the crimes he committed against the Gambians. Jawara architected this system. as the old saying goes: "as you make your bed, you must lie on it". Bruv Santangfara, the only wish i have for Jawara right now is a longer life so that he can reap the benefits of his legacy to the maximum.
Why did Jawara buy that house in England in the first place? Why couldn't he have built that house in the Gambia so that when he retires he lives in there. He knew the system he created could only favor him while he was in power.
"the man was not a bigger thief as i assume" i quote you.
Jawara was more than a "bigger" thief. Jawara refused to educate the Gambian child. He created an "information-poor" society where the few informed people will rule till kingdom come. Does anyone remember when Jawara told Gambians that the kind of politics PDOIS preaches, if they succeed, no one will even own his wife? He told Gambians that with socialism, you have to share everything including your wife. He was playing his cards well and playing the game cool. He knew what ever nonsense he spews out to the public, it would be absorbed because thats the kind of society he created.
I need to go to sleep now, but please, Jawara deserves no sympathy. In today's Gambia under Yaya, evil overrides good and thank god he spared Jawara's life to walk this long rough and raggedy green mile with the rest of us. |
me |
Edited by - BornAfrican on 25 May 2007 15:27:38 |
|
|
|
kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 09:20:07
|
B.B.Darboe's interview with the Echo is very remarkable , and kind of opened up the doors to the inner working of the defunct PPP regime.
B.B.Darboe's remarkable role in "stabilizing" the country following the coup of July 1994 is also commendable. However , throughout the interview Mr. Darboe almost resisted any aknowledgement of PPP's mistakes over it's thirty-year hegemony.
I am glad Sankareh , the interviewer brought up the issue of Jawara's overstay in power. Although B.B.Darboe trivialized that issue also , in my view it was the most important factor that led to the ouster of Jawara and PPP in 1994. The events that preceded the coup of 1994 were characterized by massive corruption in the government ( The Gambia Cooperative Union , Commercial Bank , etc, etc)perennial failing economy , and social discontent. Yet Jawara and the PPP clung to power year after year through an electoral system that was hardly independent. Jawara's failure to stick with his retirement as announced in Mansakonko in 1992 was perhaps the last straw.
There is an inherent problem with governments that stay in power for a long time , especially when there is no effective opposition. Even without the coup of 1994 , it will not be far fetched to imagine a vicious power struggle within the ppp if Jawara suddenly steps down or become incapacitated. Besides to make a constitutional excuse for Jawara and PPP's long stay in power is to ignore an important tenet of democracy and development. Extreme longevity in power , even under a facade of electoral democracy borders on autocracy. |
|
|
|
kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 09:20:07
|
B.B.Darboe's interview with the Echo is very remarkable , and kind of opened up the doors to the inner working of the defunct PPP regime.
B.B.Darboe's remarkable role in "stabilizing" the country following the coup of July 1994 is also commendable. However , throughout the interview Mr. Darboe almost resisted any aknowledgement of PPP's mistakes over it's thirty-year hegemony.
I am glad Sankareh , the interviewer brought up the issue of Jawara's overstay in power. Although B.B.Darboe trivialized that issue also , in my view it was the most important factor that led to the ouster of Jawara and PPP in 1994. The events that preceded the coup of 1994 were characterized by massive corruption in the government ( The Gambia Cooperative Union , Commercial Bank , etc, etc)perennial failing economy , and social discontent. Yet Jawara and the PPP clung to power year after year through an electoral system that was hardly independent. Jawara's failure to stick with his retirement as announced in Mansakonko in 1992 was perhaps the last straw.
There is an inherent problem with governments that stay in power for a long time , especially when there is no effective opposition. Even without the coup of 1994 , it will not be far fetched to imagine a vicious power struggle within the ppp if Jawara suddenly steps down or become incapacitated. Besides to make a constitutional excuse for Jawara and PPP's long stay in power is to ignore an important tenet of democracy and development. Extreme longevity in power , even under a facade of electoral democracy borders on autocracy. |
|
|
|
Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 12:37:09
|
bornafrican , quiet an interesting take on baba jawara .i aggree with you on almost everything you wrote .he fail us ,but also he achieve some good things .
kay ,what bb was doing is what is diplomacy at it's highes level .he uses language to divert himself from being branded a backstabber .
he was intelligent though. |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
|
|
|
Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 12:37:09
|
bornafrican , quiet an interesting take on baba jawara .i aggree with you on almost everything you wrote .he fail us ,but also he achieve some good things .
kay ,what bb was doing is what is diplomacy at it's highes level .he uses language to divert himself from being branded a backstabber .
he was intelligent though. |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
|
|
|
jambo
3300 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 13:05:47
|
i would not have sympathy with jawara, you reap what you sow, his own children and family left him, he did not do anything for gambia. he went broke in the uk, what a stupid man, all that money he received and did nothing with.
he has been judged by a higher court than mankind. |
|
|
|
jambo
3300 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 13:05:47
|
i would not have sympathy with jawara, you reap what you sow, his own children and family left him, he did not do anything for gambia. he went broke in the uk, what a stupid man, all that money he received and did nothing with.
he has been judged by a higher court than mankind. |
|
|
|
serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 16:02:48
|
BornAfrican, I am sure you know what you are talking about, and I agree that many of todays African leaders seem to be unable to see one millimeter further than their own bellies. But there is one point I must object to. You wrote:
"I am not comparing Jawara to Hitler because i know that Hitler for sure is better than him and 99% of African leaders. Why did i say so? Hitler had a vision for his people. African leaders including Jawara had and have no vision for their people. Their horizon has always been and is as limited as the eyesight of a bat in the daylight."
I think the problem with Hitler was just the fact that he thought to have a vision... We see from the Nazi era that the wrong vision can be more desastrous than no vision. |
|
|
|
serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 16:02:48
|
BornAfrican, I am sure you know what you are talking about, and I agree that many of todays African leaders seem to be unable to see one millimeter further than their own bellies. But there is one point I must object to. You wrote:
"I am not comparing Jawara to Hitler because i know that Hitler for sure is better than him and 99% of African leaders. Why did i say so? Hitler had a vision for his people. African leaders including Jawara had and have no vision for their people. Their horizon has always been and is as limited as the eyesight of a bat in the daylight."
I think the problem with Hitler was just the fact that he thought to have a vision... We see from the Nazi era that the wrong vision can be more desastrous than no vision. |
|
|
|
BornAfrican
United Kingdom
119 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2007 : 16:48:37
|
Serenata Says:
"I think the problem with Hitler was just the fact that he thought to have a vision... [b]We see from the Nazi era that the wrong vision can be more desastrous than no vision"
BornAfrican:
Hey Serenata, i must first say hi. haven't met u at the bantaba for a while. hope u cool.
With regards to Hitler, i think it is his ideology that strikes people first and they pass judgement. i don't agree with Hitler's ideology and no matter how evil it was, its bottom line was to create a society that will be the all powerful. This might sound selfish, barbaric or what ever adjective you may want to use to describe it, but it was still a vision. it was an ideology conceived, midwifed and delivered by an evil mistake called Charles Darwin, but here i am not to dwell on monster Darwin and we shall talk about another time.
The founding fathers of the modern day capitalist America had a vision to create a super power state. A state that will rule and dictate the rest of the world. Today, this "super power" state of America is a reality and they are going around dropping bombs on weaker nations whose wealth they need. What is the difference between the Nazi ideology and this "super pure" capitalist ideology? To me, there ain't no difference. They all preach the same thing: "one nation dominating the rest". The morale of this argument is that no matter how evil one's ideology is, if there is a genius vision in it, then phylosophically one can argue that there is a moral basis to it. The unfortunate thing is, its always going to affect others negatively. Chairman Mau had a vision and through his cultural revolution, a million people lost their lives. It was still a vision and unfortunately, some had to pay the price. There is always two sides to everything.
If we always want to look at the negative sides of other people's vision, then we will truly believe that "sometimes the wrong vision can be more desastrous than no vision", but "no vision" is a calamity.
Serenata, to be honest i am not going to look at the racist side of Hitler, but i do strongly believe that he is better than Jawara and 99% of today's African leaders.
Did you watch Yaya Jammeh on Aljazeera recently? His vision is shallower than that "ataya caas" in which he rations his AIDS medicine. Do you know "ataya caas", its a local name for a tumbler in which we serve green tea in the Gambia. Such is the tragedy for the African race. I would rather see an evil vision that will uplift the African nation than the current state of Africa where we are the most valueless creation that currently exists on the face of the earth. |
me |
Edited by - BornAfrican on 25 May 2007 16:52:11 |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
| Bantaba in Cyberspace |
© 2005-2024 Nijii |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
