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Momodou
Denmark
11644 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 15:02:56
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quote:
Originally posted by njucksi would assume that honour crimes would be illegal in any civilised state/nation. FGM since she is dealing with immigrants is important as any realted health cost would be picked up by the system be it medical or social services. dealing with headscarves is a major challenge for any country/Europe to keep secularism. i dont think the two can go together.
i read recently a teacher was sacked in the UK for wearing ''Taliban-imposed-liked '' clothes
back home it almost cause riots during the St Therese's School episode.
Njucks, honour killings should not be tolerated in any society. Yesterday, I watched the news on Danish TV where they talked about three recent suspected honour murders in Sweden. It seems there is a new trend of suicide among second generation immigrants. The police suspect that these are connected to honour crimes and that the young girls were pressed by the family to commit suicide. There were similar cases where young females were shot or stabbed to death by family members in Denmark too. Their only crime was to refuse marrying someone recommended by the family or choosing to get married to someone the family rejected.
With regards to the Hijab, I think a free society like Sweden should not interfere with how people should dress since they don't have school uniforms. They should respect their own principles.
The St Therese's School episode in The Gambia some years ago was caused by extremists. The school rules has to be respected with regards to uniforms. Moreover, it was their own choice to send their children to that school. We have seen children of Imams being educated at St. Augustines and St. Josephs High Schools where they learnt Bible knowledge but that never made them convert to Christianity. |
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serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 15:58:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Momodou
Njucks, honour killings should not be tolerated in any society. Yesterday, I watched the news on Danish TV where they talked about three recent suspected honour murders in Sweden. It seems there is a new trend of suicide among second generation immigrants. The police suspect that these are connected to honour crimes and that the young girls were pressed by the family to commit suicide. There were similar cases where young females were shot or stabbed to death by family members in Denmark too. Their only crime was to refuse marrying someone recommended by the family or choosing to get married to someone the family rejected.
With regards to the Hijab, I think a free society like Sweden should not interfere with how people should dress since they don't have school uniforms. They should respect their own principles.
The same goes for Germany and France. What about our praised 'religious freedom', when the hijab is forbidden but you are allowed to wear a cross?!
About 'honour killings': In Germany these murders also happen, and we had similar cases of so-called suicides which seem to be nothing but concealed murders. But stupid as some media are they didn't give any hint to this fact. |
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Cornelius
Sweden
1051 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 16:43:23
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quote:
Originally posted by serenata
Cornelius didn't get the meaning of my posting, but this is ok.
I did nothing to the man. When he showed up here in the Bantaba I was one of the very few who reacted to his sometimes highly aggressive political postings without anger.
I think he always needs someone - sometimes it's me, sometimes Alhassan - to project his phantasies and frustrations on. They seem to run wild in his head. Sorry, but this is all a little bit sick.
I would like to add that in the final analysis al-Hassan is my brother or will be when I meet him.
And here's a Big sh-mile to lighten up your face:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=al-Hassan+is+my+brother+or+will+be+when+I+meet+him&btnG=Google+SearchBy sometimes highly aggressive political postings you mean my postings during the war that Hezbollah imposed on Israel.
Look: I have a few friends from Lebanon in Sierra Leone, Ghana, LEBANON, Sweden, even the United States, like this one a childhood friend that I'm in touch with ( you can ask him)
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=Denys+Blell&btnG=Search&meta=
A no racism man: 4u2riid ( and you are talking about OUTER SPACE?) NOW you understand?
http://books.iuniverse.com/viewbooks.asp?isbn=059534061X&page=fm1
Which "phantasies and frustrations" are you talking about? you don't even know me.
" They seem to run wild in his head."
Look, I studied a little German philosophy. I am not as wild as you would like to think, and as a matter of fact I'm a sceptic. I am not one of the passionate pilgrims to your Holy See.
Well, you did light up some fanstasy and not only in me, with the story of when the wind stole your umbrella and you were drenched to the bone....remeber?
It would be good for you if you stay far away from me when fantasy is running wild in my head........James Patrick Donleavy would agree with me, that there is a devil in my head waiting, just waiting for someone....
Not sick my sister. I don't need you for anything, but if I do I'll let you know. If you ever met me you'd see how wrong you can be.
It so happens that a topic branches off to other matters. It’s almost inevitable.
On the subject of integration which also concerns the about 1500 Gambians in Sweden, then I must also add that it is not specifically only a SWEDISH problem. It’s a general European problem. Some Africans don’t feel at home in Europe. I do. I felt very much at home in Nigeria and in Ghana and I am 100% sure that I would feel 100% at home in the Gambia and even build a big house there (Rudolph would be the architect) and I’d gladly live there for the rest of my life; if it is God’s will that I do so. NO problem. I have many friends there. My brother Pat was there last August with his Zimbabwean wife and their little daughter Abrah and they thought that life was wonderful – well it’s always wonderful for tourists and it’s said that there are three kinds of people in this world: the RICH, The POOR and the tourists.
And the subject of skin – colour or hue of skin, here’s a book by a Sierra Leonean about his life in Germany.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=%22HYBRID+EYES%22+by+Osman+Sankoh&btnG=Search&meta=
A book covering my years in Sweden would be a little more colourful and perhaps even more spectacular whether aimed at the market or not – no doubt about it, this is a wonderful country and if I didn’t like it, I’d be in Florida with my sister Helga or in Holland with my brother Harold or in the UK with my brothers Patrick and Michael. There are many other places to be or not to be.
Racism in Germany:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=Racism+in+Germany&btnG=Search&meta=
The problem of integration in Germany
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=The+problem+of+integration+in+Germany+&btnG=Search&meta=
If we are on the topic of GENOCIDE and GERMANY then here is something related to Africa:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=German+atrocities+in+Namibia&btnG=Google+Search&meta=
The Herero:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=+the+Herero&btnG=Search&meta=
Now none of MY German friends are going to think that we cannot talk about it.
Although we do not know the real names of some of the people on this Bantaba or where they actually live, I am willing to answer questions that may be put to me.
I would prefer not to answer personal questions.
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Edited by - Cornelius on 19 Oct 2006 19:33:39 |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 17:08:32
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Personally, I think hijab should not be worn by children. I´ve seen many children here even as young as 5 (mostly somalian children) wearing it.
Hijab is for covering up your female beauty and to cover your figure, so I just dont get it why kids should wear it?
I also think religion is a personal choice and should not be forced on children by their parents. |
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njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 18:41:35
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| i'm not sure but i think pre-puberty girls are exempt from it.someone can correct me if i am wrong |
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jambo
3300 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 19:00:34
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serenta you are right in what you say, corn can go right off the subject sometimes.
babylon, i have also seen you girls wearing it, but i thought it was worn from 7 years old.
momodou, the st theresa incident just shows what happens when you try to impose your will on others, the fundamentalists lost people are not forced to send the children to school but only provide an education, people forget that you have a choice not to go, but ifyou do then obey the school rules and not your what you want. |
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Cornelius
Sweden
1051 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 20:29:00
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quote:
Originally posted by jambo
serenta you are right in what you say, corn can go right off the subject sometimes.
babylon, i have also seen you girls wearing it, but i thought it was worn from 7 years old.
momodou, the st theresa incident just shows what happens when you try to impose your will on others, the fundamentalists lost people are not forced to send the children to school but only provide an education, people forget that you have a choice not to go, but ifyou do then obey the school rules and not your what you want.
Jambo,
That was a good one.
Some good old mumbo-jumbo.
yu read me correctly
we read you correctly
and a man is judged according to his intentions and his deeds. |
Edited by - Cornelius on 19 Oct 2006 20:42:54 |
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Cornelius
Sweden
1051 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 21:36:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Babylon
Personally, I think hijab should not be worn by children. I´ve seen many children here even as young as 5 (mostly somalian children) wearing it.
Hijab is for covering up your female beauty and to cover your figure, so I just dont get it why kids should wear it?
I also think religion is a personal choice and should not be forced on children by their parents.
MamaBabylon
" personal choice " for innocent children would mean that they would be alerted and not remain unguarded from the evil predatory religious propaganda that secretly and openly target Muslims and lurks in our midst........ and that pass un-noticed in the hijab of integration policy.
We are told that it would be nice if we all adhered to the fundamentals of Western Civilisation (i.e basically the christain Code - turn the other cheek etc ) but wouldn't it be easier and more reasonable for all mankind to convert to Islam en masse, on the road to total integration?
Of course that is not even a possibility.
I'm taking a look at this right now. More than idleness. This is in true fulfillment of one of the aims of Bantaba and I hope that GambieBev who teaches religion among other things, is also interested in this:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=children+and+religion
And last not least, these are posted with telepathic wings and are expected as bound to follow, arriving like after a long journey
Links fall through space like the Niagara:
children and Islam
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=children+and+Islam&btnG=Search
the rights of children in Islam
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=+the+rights+of++children+in++Islam&btnG=Search
I really like this one. It's much more forthright and more manly than Ahmadinejad:
http://thegambiajournal.net/public/index.html
the rasta
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Ahmadinejad&btnG=Google+Search
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Edited by - Cornelius on 20 Oct 2006 00:58:39 |
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LEMON TIME
Afghanistan
1295 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2006 : 02:56:38
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| You again pro |
There is no god but Allah |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2006 : 10:03:40
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Cornelius, I´m not saying I have something against teaching children about religion. Even my own two daughters are being teached Islam by their father, infact they are going to the mosque on monday to celebrate that the Ramadan is over. My girls, (who are half Gambian) know some prayers even. Their father is higlhy religious and knows a lot about Islam - I could compare him with someone like Musa Pembo here at the Bantaba.
Of course you can teach children about religion, I went to sunday school myself. BUT you can not tell them to wear a hijab or become religious, you cant force them to pray. They will make that choice themselves when they are mature enough and know themselves what it really is all about, what the hijab means and if they support it or not.
In my meaning, hijab is for women and young adults who have a female figure and who have chosen to wear it themselves. Children are innocent, they are no sexual creatures.
That is what I meant. |
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Cornelius
Sweden
1051 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2006 : 12:27:20
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quote:
Originally posted by LEMON TIME
You again pro
Yes, pro-Israel |
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Cornelius
Sweden
1051 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2006 : 14:08:52
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( for Babylon)
“ you cant force them to pray." Ok.
But what does ISLAM say?
Two more important links that cover the subject. Should help them “mature enough and know themselves what it really is all about, what the hijab means and if they support it or not. “
Here your sister is urged to give up the fight and Bob Marley said, “ DON*T give up the fight.!”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6069012.stm
Of interest to other ladies:
http://search.bbc.co.uk/cgi-bin/search/results.pl?scope=all&edition=i&q=hijab
“ you cant force them to pray. They will make that choice themselves when they are mature enough and know themselves what it really is all about, what the hijab means and if they support it or not.
In my meaning, hijab is for women and young adults who have a female figure and who have chosen to wear it themselves. Children are innocent, they are no sexual creatures.
That is what I meant.”
I agree with you wholly on “hijab is for women and young adults who have a female figure and who have chosen to wear it themselves” and as for the unholy ones who do not choose to wear it, who should punish them, if ever? Their husbands or is it talaq! talaq! and talaq ! and so goes up in flames, the end of a contract of goodwill, love and understanding? So you see, the woman is not that free……..in a marriage situation if the man says “HIJAB!! And the one who decides over her own body says, “ To hell with hijab!”
Hijab has never been known to conceal the female figure ( or to reveal it) but what is usually hidden from view is just the beautiful hair, wigs, or bald patches.
Children are innocent but the paedophiles are not.
In Sweden many Children who are left to “ make that choice themselves when they are mature enough and know themselves what it really is all about “ whether by design of secularised religious instruction in further separation of church from state or citizen from “fanatical belief” usually wind up being unbelieving and kind hearted world socialists.
I know. I read my son “Animal Farm” when he was ten and the drama of injustice so incensed him.
This has nothing to do with hijabs, it’s a whole story of tyranny in comparative revolution and power politics
http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/animalfarm/
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Animal+Farm&btnG=Google+Search
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Edited by - Cornelius on 20 Oct 2006 15:04:52 |
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jambo
3300 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2006 : 15:07:32
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babylon i agree with you, you can children guidelines but let them make a decision for themselves, small children follow their families wishes.
I am surprised when i travel to africa and do not see the children with hijab, but once they hit western countries they wear them |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2006 : 15:19:57
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I would just like to say another thing about the veil. A muslim woman who don´t wear it is not less "holy" than a mualim woman who wears it. Being a true muslim is not about what you wear, and your appearence but about what is in your heart. It is the faith that should matter, not if you wear a veil or not.
A muslim who "looks like" a muslim is not always behaving like a muslim. 
That´s all I had to say for now, see y´all next week |
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Cornelius
Sweden
1051 Posts |
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| Bantaba in Cyberspace |
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