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Rainbow
Gambia
114 Posts |
 Posted - 20 Jul 2006 : 16:32:50
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Alhassan
Go back to my posting and read again... I am NOT saying you should not vote!!! I said; it is only important to vote when your votes will be counted!!!
What's the point of voting when your vote will remain in the ballot box?
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Edited by - Rainbow on 20 Jul 2006 16:39:16 |
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serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2006 : 17:06:57
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Regarding all the odd things going on, neutral observers are a must. It should be in the president's own interest to show that he is not an usurper.
But are there any consequences if observers find irregularities? I fear not. |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2006 : 18:47:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Alhassan
quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
WHAT UN. GAMBIA IS A SOVEREIGN NATION AND AS SUCH ITS CITIZENS SHOULD TAKE CHARGE OF THEIR OWN AFFAIRS. NO OUTSIDE INTERVENTIONS PLEASE. I HATE IT. UNTIL GAMBIANS CAN MUSTER THE CHANGE THEMSELVES, I WILL NOT SUPPORT ANY OUTSIDE PUSH. THAT IS WHY WE ARE CALLED A SOVEREIGN NATION.
KONDORONG,
I hope you understand why the UN exist. If elextions are ridged every time,then we must allow the Un to monitor the whole election process. Other countries like South Africa let the UN observers monitor from the registration to the voting.Withn the observers there was a Gambian. In my opinion, Gambia cannot do this alone never mine it is a sovereign nation. The UN is here to settle such matters.Gambia is part of the world too. This is my stand point.
What applies in other countries of the glob is also applicable in the Gambia when it comes to civic matters. Sister/brother
If that is the case why did the UN not send observers to the British, American, Italian, French elections? It looks like only the poor countries deserve the UN. You can do without UN if you are rich.
Gambians have to stand up to the authorities and demand a fair process. The Americans did it and so were the British and French. If only we can muster courage and be ready to sacrifice a small percentage of our population, we will get there even if it means half of the population will go jail. But ultimately, we can, without reservations, thrust our chests out and say: we did it together and not because we were forced to comply.
Outside interventions are not sustainable and costly and are directly contingent on whether a particular country has the resources that the big counties need. There is no free lunch. Therefore with all the atrocities in the Gambia, i challenge anyone on this bantab to name a Security Council resolution, or some foreign country communique regarding the trampling of freedoms in the Gambia.
Gambians have always wanted someone to fight their war for them. That is a myth and a wild dream. Dreaming with ones' eyes open is dangerous.
Gambians are more catholic than the pope. Whenever we are faced with an unpleasant task, we have resorted to naming god as the one who willed it. Rather than face it, we quietly take the divine route to justify our laziness and unwillingness to muster courage and be ready for all attendant consequences and risk to take our matters into our own hands.
Clearly junkung has challenged all Gambians that if they want to become president they have to do it like he did; muster courage and be prepared to die trying. It is a challenge that no Gambian will ever take. I do not believe he is right but he very well knows how to play on our psychy. I bet Jawara would have died on the presidency if he wanted to. THE ONLY WAY JAWARA COULD HAVE LOST OFFICE WAS WHAT JUNKUNG DID. FOR SOME REASON, A PRESIDENCY IS VERY MUCH ENTANGLED WITH RELIGION IN THE GAMBIA, AND IT IS SEEN AS A DIVINE WILL. ISLAM HAS A LOT TO DO WITH THIS BELIEVE IN THE AREA OF PREDESTINATION.
PREDESTINATION IS THE ONLY PART OF ISLAM THAT I CANNOT STILL COMPREHEND AND HAVE SINCE BEEN QUESTIONING. IF MY LIFE HAS ALREADY BEEEN PRDESTINED, WHY SHOULD I BE PUNISHED FOR THE WRONGS I COMMIT. FOR ME , PREDESTINATION IS SIMPLY THAT SINCE GOD IS ALL KNOWING, HE THOREFORE KNOWS WHO WILL OBEY HIS COMMANDS BUT HAS GIVEN US THE INDEPENDENEC TO CHOOSE OUR OWN PATH. THAT IS WHY WE HAVE HELL AND HEAVEN. THEREFORE IF WE ARE NOT INCONTROL OF OUR DECISIONS AND CHOICES, WHY SHOULD ONE BE PUNISHED FOR DISOBEYING.
The same thing was said of jawara that his baldhead had something to do with super natural powers. A baldhead is nothing more than a simple hair loss caused by chemical imbalance to sustain growth. This was more re-enforced after jawara survived the helicopter crash in 1981 somewhere in CRD in fulladu while some on board died.
No wonder though, junkung having studied under jawara, also plays to this believe that even if Gambians do not vote for him the angels will because he signed a contract with god and that his wealth is from "Allah’s central bank".
To be honest, many Gambians believe in a god given central bank to which only him has the keys. Such magical powers of the family have been spread in the early days of the coup to instill fear and it worked. Sometimes i wonder if the Gambia truly has 85% Muslims. Animists ways of life still blend with Islam and i can say with all certainty that as i write this thread, many are already kneeling or taking shoes off on the doors of those who can command the spirits.
It has become the fastest growing sector of Gambian economy since 1994. Every civil servant or public has his own spiritual authority and weekends are the busiest. People have traveled up to Mauritania, Mali, guinea, Senegal, boukinafasso, Niger to seek protection from being dismissed. Yet the list that is being developed on this forum keeps getting longer.
There is no easy path to success. The road is a rough one, hostile, deadly and only those resolved enough would make it. There is nothing impossible. The difference between possible and impossible is a measure of one's willingness.
Where was the UN in Rwandan genocide, where was UN during the horrible years of apartheid, where was the UN when Somalia was in flames, Ethiopians were dying of famine, where is the UN as far as Zimbabwe is currently concerned, where was the UN in the civil war in Angola, where was the UN in the war of independence in Namibia, where was UN when hare trampled on his citizens in Chad, where was the UN when pol pot massacred his people in Cambodia, etc. all these countries have one thing in common: poverty. Gambia is no different.
The only successful early UN intervention was in Bosnia. NOT A SINGLE NATO SOLDIRE LOST HIS LIFE UNDER THE COMMAND OF GENERAL WESLEY CLARK A ONE TIME DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIADTE. SOMETIMES I WONDER IF THE UN WAS NOT SET UP FOR THE AFRICAN PEOPLE. WE SEEM TO BE NEEDING THE UN MOST BUT CONTRIBUTE ALMOST NOTHING TO THE BODY. MANY HAVE DEFAULTED IN THEIR CONTRIBUTIONS. IN SOM COUNTRIES THE UN IS MORE RELEVANT THAN THEIR GOVERNMENTS IN TERMS HEALTH CARE, FOOD AID, EDUCATION A STABILISING FORCE AND COMMUNICATION.
THE AFRICAN TRADEMARK IS INACTION. This word is better utilized in Africa than anywhere else. We have willingly retired to be the CONSUMERS OF CIVILSATION and until when we are ready to be PARTNERS with the rest of humanity, our history and story will always be a PEOPLE, WHO SO WILLINGLY ALLOWED THEMSELVES TO BE SPECTATORS RATHER THAN PLAYERS IN THE ADVANCEMENT OF THE HUMAN RACE, HAVE LEFT THIS WORLD WITHOUT LEAVING ANY FOOTPRINTS IN THE SANDS OF TIME.
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Edited by - kondorong on 20 Jul 2006 19:44:12 |
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LEMON TIME
Afghanistan
1295 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 04:00:28
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| Surely Kondonrong you been listening to your teachers at school,bravo. |
There is no god but Allah |
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Alhassan
Sweden
813 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 12:31:02
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Kondorong,
If you dont want any intervention, how can you get things straight? As you have observed, since FAFA JAAMANO, these has beeng going on. Can you give a suggestion on how we can do it, if we dont need the UN? If you could have changed everything you should have done it. Is 'nt it? The US and EU have no such problems. I am a voter in Sweden , but we do not suffer the problems you mention so the UN has no reason to interfear. The UN can only come if you the voters demand it. They cant come and dictate. South Africa demanded it if you want to know.
Remember that these systems were forced on us without educating the people. Our systems were just thrown away without reasons. So if we want to play the game, we must abide by the rules. Don't you think so? |
Edited by - Alhassan on 21 Jul 2006 12:38:02 |
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Alhassan
Sweden
813 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 12:34:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Rainbow
Alhassan
Go back to my posting and read again... I am NOT saying you should not vote!!! I said; it is only important to vote when your votes will be counted!!!
What's the point of voting when your vote will remain in the ballot box?
Sister Rainbow,
I appolojize for misquoting you.
How do you know that your vote is not counted? Where you present during the counting or were you informed by another person? Those who give you the information must be bold enough to come out. Rumors and speculations are not strange to Gambian journalists and some of us. We must be careful of Radio Kangkang. |
Edited by - Alhassan on 21 Jul 2006 12:37:15 |
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Rainbow
Gambia
114 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 14:00:25
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I've closed my side of this case!!! HAVE A LOVELY WEEKEND |
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LEMON TIME
Afghanistan
1295 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 14:02:06
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| ON LOL |
There is no god but Allah |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 18:49:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Alhassan
Kondorong,
If you dont want any intervention, how can you get things straight? As you have observed, since FAFA JAAMANO, these has beeng going on. Can you give a suggestion on how we can do it, if we dont need the UN? If you could have changed everything you should have done it. Is 'nt it? The US and EU have no such problems. I am a voter in Sweden , but we do not suffer the problems you mention so the UN has no reason to interfear. The UN can only come if you the voters demand it. They cant come and dictate. South Africa demanded it if you want to know.
Remember that these systems were forced on us without educating the people. Our systems were just thrown away without reasons. So if we want to play the game, we must abide by the rules. Don't you think so?
My honest believe is that Gambians are truly not yet ready to change their government. It is a bitter pill to swallow but it’s the truth. Unfortunately, those who want a change in the Gambia are a minority who most often live outside the borders of the country and hence don’t vote. Even if they do, they cannot bring about change. Democracy is about patience and allowing the will of the people to shape in a way that is not dictated or forced on them.
I believe we will when we are ready. I may not like the pace at which we are getting there, but i surely respect the will of the people. We need more educating but it may not come that easy. Politics is deeply mixed with religion in the Gambia and predestination is at the core of this problem. Unless Gambians are able to fully understand predestination, any Tom Dick and Harry can seize power, match on our noses and yet we are grateful that we could breathe here and there at his or her will.
I very well remember Sedia saying that whenever someone is given a ride in a government vehicle, they become so grateful and just forget that the vehicle actually belongs to them and they are even paying that very public servant driving the car. What is happening is that we are given crumbs from what is actually ours and we become so grateful, that we enslave ourselves for the so called “generosity”. Jawara, I believe reinforced this problem by printing his image of the currency. It confirmed the notion, especially in the Sene-gambia region an old saying that the power lies with the king. It never helped educated Gambians about the separation of powers and the difference between a state and a government. These are two separate entities and should not be allowed to converge. We all have heard sayings like “Jawara’s money, the rulers money etc confirming what we traditionally have always known before. That kings own everything. No wonder people still go to statehouse and ask the president to help finance their projects. He in turn dishes out cash from Allah’s central bank confirming the divine belief in the Gambia that rulers are there because God appointed them and no man should challenge divine Will.
This might sound ridiculous. There is a believe that about how a child to become a ruler is conceived. The believe is that it happens only on a day when no adult male ever touched his spouse except the couple that would bear the leader confirming Divine intervention which certainly and statistically is almost impossible. It confers patronage.
Africans, i dare say, have not embraced democracy in our history. We were used to kings and kingdoms with absolute authority. No elections were ever conducted. Our Alkalos, chiefs are not elected. You are born in the family to qualify. Even for the position of the Imam, only a particular family can be an Imam. It is not based on who is most educated. This clearly explains the few mosques even in Serrekunda pre- 1994. Only one mosque was allowed in the whole of Bundung even though we badly needed many. The mosque at London Conner, which borders with Bundung just around the former director of immigration's home was not allowed to be a mosque by those in Bundung. One thing that APRC brought to us is the ability to pray and build mosques anywhere without let or hindrance. After July 1994, Bundung had at least five fully fledge mosque excluding the original mosque around Nusrat High School.
To come back to your point, Gambians should be the ones who should bring about the change and not outsiders. By allowing others to come in, means we are giving up our sovereignty, which therefore means that for any change, outsiders must be brought in. We have to build the capacity internally to succeed. NO WONDER GAMBAINS BELIEVE THAT ONLY CONSULTANTS CAN DEVELOP OUR COUNTRY. IT IS A MYTH. A CONSULTANT IS NO MORE THAN SOMEONE WHO BORROWS YOUR WATCH TO TELL YU THE TIME.
Clearly we have capacity. Senior civil servants are running the new found country of East Timor, we are on international bodies influencing world policies, how come then we cannot do it for a country with just 1.2 million people just the size of Lagos in Nigeria. The widest point in the Gambia is 50 kilometers and in some places, its just about 30 kilometers. Gambia is just a city or a borough.
East Timor is far more complex a problem than Gambia. If we can do it there, we can do it at home. South Africa's case was a unique one and they do need UN for that. Gambians still do not realise that power derives from them. But how do you convince a group who since time immemorial, have never been asked to decide the fate of their leaders. Absolute monarchy was what we ever knew. Our chiefs were semi gods. Jayang has told us of a chief who used to tie suspects with chains like you would pet a monkey in your yard. These atrocities happened after independence in the Gambia where the rule of law was supposed to have taken place and it happened when Jawara was in power. Sheriff Dibba must be credited for bringing a stop to this outrageous abuse of power although he himself is from a chiefdom class in Baddibu.
NO WONDER SHERIFF ALSO SOMETIMES FALLS VICTIM TO HIS ANCESTRAL TIES OF BEING NOBILITY. HIS FAMOUS LALO KEBBA TUNE WAS : BANKU KANTALA NING MANSA TEH KILIN TI" Meaning a servant of the people is not the same as a King. Jawara was from the cobbler caste, a low caste in the Gambia who have never handled any political position within the manding empire of our region. Traditionally they deal in leather products. It was historical in the subregion whilst sheriff of course is from the nobility in Baddibu. Personally i do not believe in caste and never will. I just thought i needed to bring up some historical issues into perspective. However, jawara has proofed that a caste has nothing to do with abilities. It was discriminatory in every form and so were the smiths. I DONT BELIEVE IN PRIVILEDGES BUT RIGHTS.
The unfortunate part of our history and which speaks for most of Africa is that artisans and skilled labor was not given any respect and as such has retarded our leap into technological advancement. Although very skillful, they were not respected, under paid for their labor. In fact there was a common phrase for it in Banjul called: WACHA RAHASOU which means having to wash ones hands at the end of a days work. The hands of smiths, mechanics, and carpenters etc are usually dirty. No wonder the secondary technical schools could not succeed. No Gambian wanted a WACHA RAHASOU job. Everyone respects the tie and suit and pushing a pen behind a desk. I must admit as a young man in first grade when i was asked what i wanted to be in life, i replied a Commissioner. I did not know what they do, but i did know that they were very important in my community. I was just a seven year old kid trying to live his dream
Our roads, arch 22, airport, furniture, are made by non gambians. We have a serious national security problem. We have become so dependent on foreign labor that the country grinds to almost halt during tobaski when most senegalsese go home. Fish and meat becomes scare, no taxi drivers available, stores closed, most broken cars have to wait fo the senegalse to return, nice dresses also wait for them to come back etc. Personally, Junkung is not the problem. We are our own problem. It is unfortunate, but it is the reality.
We have to act now and not wait for outside help, for tomorrow might be too late and the opportunity will have passed with the hope a vibrant, democratic, educated, healthy Gambia, standing side by side as partners with other nations in the pursuit of wisdom and human advancement. History has shown that out side interventions are not sustainable. The Korean peninsula is a case in point. YOU CAN TAKE A HORSE TO A RIVER, BUT CANNOT FORCE IT TO DRINK
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Edited by - kondorong on 21 Jul 2006 20:53:24 |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 20:00:55
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quote:
Originally posted by LEMON TIME
Surely Kondonrong you been listening to your teachers at school,bravo.
So were all of you. I am proud of everyone here on bantaba. I just happen to have learnt form you all intellectual giants. IF A CHILD WASHES HIS HANDS, HE MAY EAT WITH KINGS. May be you helped me wash my hands. |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 20:49:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Alhassan
Kondorong,
If you dont want any intervention, how can you get things straight? As you have observed, since FAFA JAAMANO, these has beeng going on. Can you give a suggestion on how we can do it, if we dont need the UN? If you could have changed everything you should have done it. Is 'nt it? The US and EU have no such problems. I am a voter in Sweden , but we do not suffer the problems you mention so the UN has no reason to interfear. The UN can only come if you the voters demand it. They cant come and dictate. South Africa demanded it if you want to know.
Remember that these systems were forced on us without educating the people. Our systems were just thrown away without reasons. So if we want to play the game, we must abide by the rules. Don't you think so?
Oh boy this is culture. I have not heard of this phrase for years. You are taking me down memeory lane. |
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salimina
253 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 21:10:56
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| Kon, what a wonderful piece!very busy but in time i will join with you. |
Edited by salimina |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jul 2006 : 21:28:07
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quote:
Originally posted by salimina
Kon, what a wonderful piece!very busy but in time i will join with you.
The floor is your salimina. |
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Sitasungo
77 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jul 2006 : 00:06:54
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Hi guys,
I was a biy busy but this country is already spoilt.I saw alkalos lying under oath saying some people they don't even know the name of to be citizens and when the IEC men/women ask who the name of their parents were,the Alkalo cannot name.Infact one alkalo had to call an APRC observer to complain and I heard him saying to the boy but your boss said we would not be asked all these difficult questions?I don't know this woman how can I say she is a Gambian and as the boy continued to press the Alkalo,I came nearer and told the Alkalo that he is not only cheating the whole Gambia but his own Family beacuse oneday those they are registering would have to compete this village with their childreen and grand childreen.He looked at me for a long time I think he was thinking of my words.
This country may be very very very bad after Jammeh.So much had been crucked and if we don't live like South Africa to forgive each other,tempers may flow.There are families not speakings communities split intwo,tribes accusing each other and areas hating others.I was in a vehicle going up when we reached Kanfenda[Kanilai Junction],women started running towards our vehicle with cold water/ice and wonjo.One old man looked at them and shaked his head three times.A man by his side asked they were speaking wollof and the old man said in a low tune,you see our sweet,our tax only one village is enjoying while we fece more and more hardship.We cannot even get our groungnuts bought.As we moved,one lady over heard them and temper flared up but majority of the passengers were supporting the old man and all words were hauled at this Mandinka woman many things were said I cannot repeat.There was another mandinka who was even insulting mandinlkas blaming them for everything Jammeh is doing.
I just prayed Gambia may breed hatred long.We need a miracle to save us
sitasungo. |
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ylowe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jul 2006 : 06:28:54
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| Kondorong, you sure did not spent your lunch money on "attaya". laugh |
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