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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
 Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 15:47:53
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Cultural heritage (for e.g Serere animism, hinduism, judaism, paganism etc) is not comparative to other religions (for e.g Christianity, Islam).
This religion (Judaism) is considered as forming the basis of the cultural and social identity of the Jews
Cultural rituals and practice is all about dark ages and getting stuck in crude ideology, corrupted over time and towards tendency of discrimination.
Religion is about EQUALITY, UNIVERSALITY, HUMANITY & PIETY FOR MANKIND. Its only through Islam that we can understand HOW TO DEFINE THOSE TERMS IN ARABIC for e.g;
"Yaa baani Adam" = HUMAN RACE. The quran is a letter addressed to the human race and not for any other purpose. It does not belong to arabs, africans, asians, muslims, christians, jews, wollof, serere etc.
"ALLAH" = Unique name of ONLY ONE SUPREME GOD FOR ALL MANKIND = UNIVERSALITY IN SENSE OF DIRECTION TOWARDS ONLY ONE SUPER BEING & MASTER OF THE UNIVERSE, WITH 100 ATTRIBUTES THAT EMPOWERED HIM ABOVE "YAA BAANI ADAM".
"LAA ILLAHA ILLAL LAH" = THERE IS NO GOD EXCEPT ALLAH
More on last sermon of Prophet Muhamad to get the message about Islam under http://www.alhafeez.org/lastsermon.htm
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 16:38:50
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I find this subject very interesting. We should all try to be tolerant of each other and then the world would be a better place.
People have the right to be free to follow whatever culture and belief system they like aslong as it is not anti another groups freedoms.
I find Animism interesting and there are certain parrallels with paganism. They are both the original belief systems and then Islam and Christianity have swept in and taken over festivals etc as their own.
There is a world of difference between religious indoctrination and religious education. Indoctrination has NO PLACE in schools.
Educating the whole child to be knowledgeable about different religions and philosophies so they can make their own decision about their world view and beliefs. Knowledge about other cultures and religions should also help people to be more tolerant and understanding of others.
Once again we are back to education. In general, the more educated the person the less religious they are (IN GENERAL I SAID!  ).
Generally religion serves as a social control to keep people behaving in a certain way.
Tamsier I respect your views even though I don't agree with them. I wish you could do the same to others when you post on here. Elevate the discussions to beyond the personal level.
Tell us more about Serere Animists and their beliefs. |
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 17:50:20
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Tamsier, thanks
Xoy Festival, very interesting, I find it contradictory to call it “Animist” and not “Serere cosmology” or “Serere religion”. Calling it “animist” undermines its very base. And placing it in the category of “African Animism” diminishes its value.
The contradiction is” Cutting the very branch one is sitting on”. Diminishing the value of a religion one is fighting for
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Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
Edited by - Janko on 15 Jun 2010 17:51:34 |
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toubab1020
12306 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 18:35:54
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Janko, please,EVERYONE is entitled to believe what they want it is their choice alone,they can call their belief, religion or faith whatever they want to call it.
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"Simple is good" & I strongly dislike politics. You cannot defend the indefensible.
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 18:55:37
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Toubab1020,
don’t get me wrong, “animism” is not a self-definition term but a stigma, a cliché, whiles “Serere Religion” is self-definition.
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Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
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tamsier
United Kingdom
556 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 19:02:00
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quote:
Originally posted by njucks
Tamsier,
there will always be protests from one group or another, which can take different forms.. the neo-conservatives, belonging to one islamic sect or another in Senegal were just having a field day at Seneweb, this time they got away with it, they will be bolder and someday it will get out of hand.
so many including myself have learnt so much about serer culture from you on the bantaba.
can you share your experiences (positive) from the festival, e.g. how many people attended, is the festival growing from last year, what format does it take... any pictures.
Hi Njucks,
I will try not to respond to some of these people who seem to think that all Serere Animists and my High Priests and Priestess deserve to be insulted and cursed simply because of my views on Islam on Bantaba. LOL!!!
Anyway, I missed the Xoy last year but my friends and cousins who attended last year said more people turned up this year than the previous. Thousands attended this year. Fatick was so jammed packed you have to force your way just to get in or out. It is indeed bigger than year before last. I spent the duration of my stay at my uncle’s house. One of the first things I did days before the Xoy was to visit the megaliths and the burial tombs of the old Kings of Sine: – Lat Souk Fanam Faye, Kumba Ndoffene Famak Joof, the remarkable Semou Mak Joof who committed suicide in 1881 by shooting himself on the head etc, etc. It was a moving experience especially if you know the historical account of these kings and the part they played in preserving the Serere’s way of life and religion. I also went to the river Sine where I offered a sacrifice to the Goddess Mindisse by throwing a coin into the river. In the old days people use to throw gold nuggets, stones etc. Now people put coins in the River. The Minister of culture as well as the Mayor of Fatick attended the ceremony as guests of honour. However, they were not the main attraction it was the High Priests and Priestesses who everyone wanted to see and hear from. On the arrival of these High Priests and Priestesses, all hell broke loose. They were fully attired in their ceremonial gowns, beads and hats . As usual, they perform the ancient rituals and then gave their divination in the Serere tongue in their usual coded message format that only a Serere Animist or someone who speak Serere can understand. The farmers in particular were very interested in knowing whether the amount of rainfall is going to be good this year. To their satisfaction, the High Priests forecast a good rain fall etc. There was also some controversy in newspaper that attended. They accused the High Priests of meddling in Political affairs by predicting the possible outcome of the next general election. That was surprising, because I and many others were in the ceremony and did not hear any of the Priests and Priestess forecasting who is going to win the next general election. Looks like some journalist just wanted a juicy story. LOL!! Overall it was a wonderful ceremony and a great event to take children to apart from the criminals mentioned above. The food is great as well.
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Tamsier
Serere heritage. Serere religion. Serere to the end.
Roog a fa ha. |
Edited by - tamsier on 15 Jun 2010 19:14:46 |
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tamsier
United Kingdom
556 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 19:10:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Janko
Tamsier, thanks
Xoy Festival, very interesting, I find it contradictory to call it “Animist” and not “Serere cosmology” or “Serere religion”. Calling it “animist” undermines its very base. And placing it in the category of “African Animism” diminishes its value.
The contradiction is” Cutting the very branch one is sitting on”. Diminishing the value of a religion one is fighting for
Hi Janko, I get the point you are making. Some of us including myself use the phrase Serere Animism to others who do not know what we are talking about. If we say Serere, they will think it is just a tribe, but as we all Sereres know,there is more to the word Serere than just a tribe. We call ourselves Serere which is an ethno-religion. All serere values, custom, tradition etc stems from our religion. Nevertheless I get the point you are making. It is merely to ease understanding. Are you Serere? |
Tamsier
Serere heritage. Serere religion. Serere to the end.
Roog a fa ha. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 19:20:54
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| Is this festival in Gambia or Senegal or elsewhere? |
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tamsier
United Kingdom
556 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 19:25:25
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quote:
Originally posted by gambiabev
Is this festival in Gambia or Senegal or elsewhere?
Its in Senegal, in Sine. That's were the Sereres are numerous and the homeland of the Sereres. |
Tamsier
Serere heritage. Serere religion. Serere to the end.
Roog a fa ha. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 23:03:42
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So in Senegal would other tribes be animist too? Or is it specifically Serre. Some Wollof I have met seem to have similar views.
Could a white tourist attend such an event? would you be welcome? |
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tamsier
United Kingdom
556 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 23:14:06
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quote:
Originally posted by gambiabev
So in Senegal would other tribes be animist too? Or is it specifically Serre. Some Wollof I have met seem to have similar views.
Could a white tourist attend such an event? would you be welcome?
Of course a white tourist can attend and be welcome. The problem would of course be understanding what the priests are saying or doing, but if you have a Serere friend they could interpret for you. There are other Animist tribes e.g Jola. Some mixed it with christianity and some are Orthodox . I have yet to meet a wolof who is Orthodox Animist. Some may blend general Animist rituals with Islam but they are muslims and not through and through Animists. They lost the names of their Gods and animist practices when they accepted islam. I doubt you will find a wolof who can remember the name of their supreme God or rituals pre-islam. |
Tamsier
Serere heritage. Serere religion. Serere to the end.
Roog a fa ha. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2010 : 23:26:03
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| Very interesting, Thank you. |
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njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2010 : 00:19:40
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quote:
Originally posted by tamsier
................One of the first things I did days before the Xoy was to visit the megaliths and the burial tombs of the old Kings of Sine: – Lat Souk Fanam Faye, Kumba Ndoffene Famak Joof, the remarkable Semou Mak Joof who committed suicide in 1881 by shooting himself on the head etc, etc. It was a moving experience especially if you know the historical account of these kings and the part they played in preserving the Serere’s way of life and religion.
thanks,
as you know i'm very interested in regional/senegambian history/culture/migration etc well this is not a promise but ''God willing'' i will try and attend this festival one day,
i've always wanted to visit the Sine area especially Senghor village, fadiouth. |
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tamsier
United Kingdom
556 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2010 : 00:43:11
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| I'm sure you would have a great time. Yes! Joal-Fadiouth is great. Very full of history too. Joal was where Kumba Ndoffene Famak was assasinated in Novemember 1871 by French. |
Tamsier
Serere heritage. Serere religion. Serere to the end.
Roog a fa ha. |
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2010 : 14:09:39
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quote:
Originally posted by tamsier
Hi Janko, I get the point you are making. Some of us including myself use the phrase Serere Animism to others who do not know what we are talking about. If we say Serere, they will think it is just a tribe, but as we all Sereres know,there is more to the word Serere than just a tribe. We call ourselves Serere which is an ethno-religion. All serere values, custom, tradition etc stems from our religion. Nevertheless I get the point you are making. It is merely to ease understanding. Are you Serere?
Tamsier,
You see, there are no peoples who are as kindhearted as Africans. Your generosity to those who do not know what we are talking about is a good example. However, I think those who genuinely want to understand our worldview should do it from our point of view. So, even whereas I understand your kindheartedness, using the lens of animism has unwilling effects that sway from understanding the real meaning of Serere theology (involving science, philosophy, knowledge of the divine and religion).
It is blissful that such institution and knowledgebase exists in our area. It is my standpoint that as far as we have such knowledgebase, there is still hope that we can recover some important aspects of our philosophy and believe systems. Hence, these are central to our way forward, our independence and self-understanding.
Am no Serere, but a Senegambian who has great respect and admiration for their steadfastness, watchfulness and strength in maintaining and keeping such an institution, knowledgebase. My wish is to attain this festival some day.
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Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
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