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shaka
996 Posts |
 Posted - 05 Jan 2010 : 00:42:54
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Happy new year to you too man.!!!!quote:
Originally posted by Dalton1
Bro Turk,
Something I will be borrowing from you in my contribution to Janko's Debate under this debate, and that is, 'internationalist'.
I am almost done with a lengthy research with some interesting findings.
Happy new year bro shaka!
yj
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shaka
996 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jan 2010 : 01:00:52
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I try not to be comforted too much with promises, especially when they come from politicians. Nevertheless you have raised some very important points and i hope our politicians find value in them. My PC is still in intact even though it is sometimes hard surpress the rage that builds up inside when you try to understand how the dictatorship back home tries to justify its excesses by insulting our intelligence.quote:
Originally posted by Janko
Thanks, Shaka,
Interesting outline of the difficulties we are faced with and you made it clear that something needs to be done hence too late is better than never. There is no disagreement, the different points of departure is healthy.
An alternative development plan that is not financed is not credible. However following the financial proposal to the letter is not important the point is to have a comprehensive picture of the plan in its entirety and to put the development plan in perspective.
The idea of an annual budget proposition is to set the bar high hence we do not expect anything less from our politicians. An annual budget proposition would put the opposition on top of things not only at home but internationally as well and would be a healthy principle for keeping the political arena informed and updated.
I do not remember the last time I heard our politicians argue with concrete figures concerning political agendas or projects, or ideas. Nor have I ever heard them discourse each others political positions concretely and in terms of financial possibilities.
Your takes are worthwhile and without the PC, well, there would be no exchange between us. Yes, sometimes I think there is no hope especially when I think about W. Juwaras prophesies. I try to find what has changed in the political arena since the last elections and if nothing new happen what the outcome would be?
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mbay
Germany
1007 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jan 2010 : 09:50:12
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I know one thing and that is, we should not paint the Gambia/ns as united color of nation.
The Gambia/ns are dragging daily to tribalism/jealousness.
In my last three month in Africa, I find my beloved country alarmingly & very freighting which is unusually.
We have too much enviousness in us and not only in politic but general and that is appalling and disturbing.
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jan 2010 : 00:04:01
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Thanks Mbay
That is reason enough for Mr. Politician to present something that bring people together, something to engage their minds and time, something that puts the country in the centre of awareness and on the forefront of everyday reality. But if that something is missing it creates an empty space in the mind which then is filled with the banalities of tribalism, envy and corruption.
Mr. Politician is not engaging us in meaningful dialogue and yet wants our votes.
Mr. Politician
What is new in your political programme since the last elections
Should we vote for you - why
What would you do different this time
Put your ideology (liberalism, capitalism, socialism, communism, africanism etc.) in perspective for us to get the picture as clearly as possible. WE are waiting
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Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
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toubab1020
12311 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jan 2010 : 12:06:04
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Very good suggestions Janko,but I think that "Mr. Politician" is exactly that, a single entity, who has no concept of working within a team,in other words,a prospective presidential candidate,this concept of course fills the present administration with great foreboding,here again Gambian "Mr Politician" has to think about attitudinal change,will that happen,I wonder,I suspect that things will stay the same,in which case no change.
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"Simple is good" & I strongly dislike politics. You cannot defend the indefensible.
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shaka
996 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2010 : 00:10:24
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| C'mon Janko, you do not want to put all the burden of society's probem on the shoulders of politicians, do you? What have politicians got to do with an individual's envy or jealousy against another? What exactly are you agreeing with Mbay's statement? Have you tried asking Mbay to share with you the tribalism he is talking about? Is jealousy and envy equal tribalism? I hope you are not telling us an individual Wollof or Mandinka's jealousy or envy against a Jola or Fula is all down to tribalism? What is really worrying about Gambians and The Gambia is not tribalism, but linking everyday social angst and ill-feelings between individuals to tribalism. Jealousy and envy pre-dates tribes and politicians, so why should tribalism and politics always be ridiculousy faulted for these social ills? I think the word tribalism had probably lost any meaningful defination with the way it had been bandied about as everything evil in The Gambia. Gambians need to chill the hell out!! This fear-mongering will never yield us anything useful in any unity effort or exercise. We got to stop crying wolf. |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2010 : 02:11:27
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Part I
Al-Quran
(49:13) O mankind, We created you from one man and one woman, and then divided you into nations and tribes so that you may recognize one another. Indeed, the most honorable among you in the sight of Allah is he who is the most pious of you. *28 Surely, Allah is All-knowing, All-Wise.
Janko,
I kicked off now. I've had a long debate with my Oustazz on this verse. I share with you its context and commentary.
To be continued...
yj
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"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2010 : 02:41:38
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Part II
(Ref: www.dictionary.com)
tr·al·ism
n.
1. The organization, culture, or beliefs of a tribe.
2. A strong feeling of identity with and loyalty to one's tribe or group.
rac#8901;ism
1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.
2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.
I based my paper on the above verse, and the dictionary definations..
To be continued.........
yj
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"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2010 : 03:00:45
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(Ref: http://www.quranenglish.com/tafheem_quran/049.htm)
The context of the above verse was researched on the above links, all courtesy should be given, unconditionally.
Part III
Tribalism and Racism;
An Opinion complementing Janko’s Debate
By Yero Jallow, USA
A reference of ‘dictionary.com’ gives the above as definitions to both “Tribalism” and “Racism.” Referencing Allah’s Quran also gave us a very illuminating verse above, (49:13.)
Over the ages, people all over depended on book definitions which are of course man-made; God’s own constitutional stipulations, otherwise called the rule of nature; and actions stirred by the vices of tribalism and racism among people and nations everywhere. It is factual to note that racism and tribalism leads to division, hatred, conflicts and hinders development everywhere. Like ‘Turk’ said somewhere, I too would rather be an internationalist than any of the groupings. It couldn’t simpler in thought.
With the Gambian opposition, I think it is a sad case, if at all what is holding unity for a coalition is tribalism or racism, which I am a bit skeptical of it being entirely the main factor, not at all doubting its shameful existence in small portions everywhere, as seen ruining other nations and people, for example Kenya. I tend to believe that selfishness and power greed has a greater role to play than tribalism or racism. The situation to where we are in self-denial of its existence, combined with blame game, throat-fighting, and suppressive behavior hasn’t help at all. As progressive people, we must move beyond jealousy, hatred, pettiness, profiling, tribalism, racism, and all the vices with a clear conscience to redeem our clarity of mind independence –sincerity, and pave a diverse world of people and nations. The very existence of the enemy and his accomplices among us further complicates our unity effort. The enemy in most cases is steps ahead of our thinking, and seemingly terrorize and un-hatch all efforts for unity by all possible means, as noted in the many arrest, maiming and detentions of opposition members, illegally. All these points, combined with our own attitude (whatever of it is wrong) makes it easy for the issue of tribes and races to come in, the kind of ‘divide-and-rule’ technique, something that dictators and world oppressors are so excellent at doing in controlling the political temperature to their advantage. The best way forward, reference posting on Bantaba Cyberspace, “An Open letter to Gambians & friends” I authored prior to the July 4th gathering in Atlanta. The write-up targeted a great audience, and was distributed in many forums, including the GPU, Gambia-L, and Gambia Post. In my honest view, it truly defined the struggle at hand, and directed even the loose minds; or wants-to-be detractors to the struggle at hand.
Back to the issue of tribalism and racism, together with all biases, segregations, hatreds, divisions, etc…that may be geared towards others, it is absolutely wrong, and a total shame to humanity. It is not enough to have friends, relatives and associates across the board, but in reality no one should exercise such tendencies of tribalism and racism, anytime, anywhere. The many vices are outdated and the current global world should live beyond it. It even becomes harder, as the situation of judging others lies entirely on other humans, a normal phenomenon of biases and notions, so to say. Former US President Aba. Lincoln (of beloved memory) argued it perfectly when he noted that all humans are created equal before God, Almighty. This is the very doctrine of human equality. But it is better said than done; better worded than actualized; and easier said than practiced.
Having said that, it is at a time when we should adopt JFK’s great quote, “Ask not what your country can do for you; but what you can do for your country.” Instead of the blame game on the opposition, I tend to give them more support, sympathy over their predicament, in a true situation of oppression. In the case of the Diaspora, the mass believed to be the educated and enlightened ones, sometime exercise more disuniting tendencies than the opposition at home, simply noted in the online debate in these forums and other media outlets. Great many of us are key-board heroes, making loud noises. Well, hail Mary, hail Paul! –that there is no silence -a voice representing the oppressed. In our efforts, we prostituted the very idea of true activism, as the oppressed time and again, fight among themselves, instead of uniting to fight the oppressors. Back to the opposition, well…they are home with the dictator, and still showing some defiance openly which is very courageous.
Without ignoring the points Janko raised, I agree with the side of his argument, instead of opposition members and their followers getting trapped on tribalism and racism gowns, it should be rather development projects, ways for unity, food, employment, schools, hospitals, roads, markets, bridges, ships, air transport, dwellings, good sanitation, public transport, agriculture, tourism, etc…etc…and the unending list that makes America, for example, what it is –a great diverse nation of a people unified by vision of infrastructural development rather than tribes and races, despite the chunks of the unspeakable everywhere.
Tribalism and racism are vices that come to havoc decent societies. It is wicked; spite, un-natural and a lasting form of biasness and complexity rooted in the hearts and minds of people such that the cankerworm grows with lasting age, shamefully. Incurable to some degree, as it pushes those stocked in it to the door of no return. At that point, it will be a combination of racism or tribalism, complexity and forceful self-denial. I think I am a firm believer of Quinton Cummings when he said, “They speak to you like angels; and they behave like stupid human beings.” The self-denial syndrome becomes the order of the day, as hardly anyone admits exercising tribal or racial tendencies when caught doing it, even to whereas obvious to the very eye and mind that such treble tendencies of tribe and race surface their ugly faces among us, time and again . By getting trapped to the shameful, tribalists and racists believes they are fighting a legitimate crusade against their perceived rival tribes and races, the same way that religious extremists and intolerant bigots argues about justifying their spoken words and actions. Further, it is in the form of territorial defense, which is truly fake and deceiving! The age should be beyond pretending to be diverse and tolerant in the exterior but in the interior, these vices are rooted in mindsets and grinding to particles in supposedly great hearts and minds. As for an alternative, since it is a disease, everyone should heal and cleanse themselves of it, be it the small one or the major one, the same way you go to a doctor for medical help; a teacher for a tough Mathematical sum; an architect for a construction plan, etc…etc…If one doesn’t heal, together with ignorance of human reality, selfishness, complexity, extremism, etc… just makes a perfect time bomb anytime, ready to explode.
Back to the first fundamental rule of equality as observed by former US President, Aba. Lincoln (Of beloved memory) that all humans were created equal before God Almighty –no doubt that is true! Where we are getting at which to the exterior we all agree that no nation is better than another; no race is better than another; and in short humanity is all equal. While this is true, human biases, inferior complexities and personal judgment tainted the very doctrine of equality. No human should see another human as superior, except per excellence in deeds, but this hasn’t been practiced in deeds by many a people. Nations as great as America struggled to root out the palaver as noted in the struggles of Dr. King, Lincoln, Malcolm, and the much more…today, proud to comfort themselves with a black president in the person of Obama; a Muslim law maker in congress in the person of Honorable Keith Ellison, etc...With an unending list of diversity and tolerance observed. Politically, this is a true miracle. Can other nations do the same? Possibly sometime in life, but not so soon.
My appeal goes to even the non-believers of Islam, and referencing God’s verse above should be enough to pave unity among different tribes and races. In my humble observation, the Quran and the life of Prophet Muhammad (SAW) is the best reference for cementing tribes and races together. It also teaches many treaty concepts adopted by the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) that when adopted will yield a positive result. There is none that can deny the fact that Muhammad (SAW) united all the tribes and races, to the extent that none else did in this world, and today as can be seen, a nation of his Umma (people) constitute all tribes and races.
Author’s note: I wrote the piece in the capacity of an internationalist, in an effort to complement Janko’s debate at the Bantaba Cyberspace (www.gambia.dk). The piece is strictly an opinion, generally written and not directed to any particular individual, tribe, race, country, continent, or organization, except in the case sparking ideas for reform in character and deeds for humanity everywhere. I appeal to all readers to read it with an open mind, the very reason for my endeavors to participate in it. The topic is a very sensitive topic…so read only a general contribution line.
Thank you.
Conclusions to be continued…. |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Edited by - Dalton1 on 12 Jan 2010 22:19:24 |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2010 : 07:10:32
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Part IV; "It's you!"
This was a poem I wrote, intended to address the finger-pointing involved in tribalism and racism.
http://www.gambia.dk/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5200
To be continued...Part V, VII, and VIII (conclusion will follow soon...stay tuned.......... |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Edited by - Dalton1 on 12 Jan 2010 21:24:33 |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2010 : 22:22:37
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Part V
Here was an article I wrote after the formation of NADD.
Opinion
GOOD LUCK TO OUR COALITION
Our dear coalition, I write to salute you all in the spirit of peace. Congratulations !! Your brothers and sisters at home and abroad are watching you from far and near. NADD will not be alone in the struggle to another re-birth of democracy in our dear motherland. I have realized, the road map to NADD wasn't an easy task but thanks to Almighty God , that at long last an agreement is being reached. History will have you in records, in as much as humanity exist on earth.
Our dear coalition,Now that NADD is formed, i feel duty bound to offer my advice to all under this umbrella. It's not the coalition pillars alone but all who believe in democracy and respect for human rights. People in the whole world need to live in peace. Peace can only exist where there is freedom and justice. Bringing freedom and justice to play is called true democracy. This would mean our political, media and human rights activists will all air their voices loud and clear without any fear.
Our dear coalition, It must be clearly noted that we are not only hungry for a Gov't change but a system change is what we call for. So let our brothers in the coalition all be centered in this sentiment. Let there be no selfishness or personal interest gain exercised at all. There should be much carefulness in dealing with our young society. People of all tribes should be respected in their political opinions. Let the initiators strictly abide by whatever rules they have to come out with, in the interest of all Gambians. Let the coalition exercise much patience, tolerance and diversity in their dealings with the masses. It's never impossible to say the truth. Don't promise what you cannot give, but rather sensitise the people of their rights.
Our dear coalition, your brothers and sisters are watching you and we are monitoring your words and your actions. You are our educated ones, our activists and our heads onto whom we rely on for rescue when we are sinking in the deep oceans. So please, don't betray us ! Don't Forget the past day, the ongoing day and the future day, for many came in with pure intentions only to end up being bad ones. Let the politics be tactical, for only then you can win the hearts of the masses. Our Gambia is too small, taking to violence will only help to divide us more. So be wise and spend all the available time in uniting and sensitising the people.
Our dear coalition, Put in place a well defined agenda, this would include telling the people what you will do for them. Tell our poor farmers how you will improve their lives. Give them assurance that their farm-lands and their animals are priority. Let the majority of the populace (our dear youths) know the job projects and sports facilities ahead, come victory in 2006. Our supporters and non-supporters need assurance of peace and tolerance. Our journalists will want to see their press freedom respected. Our students must know what you are keeping for them, fair opportunities to further their education. Our civil society need to know that they will not be subjected to random hire and fire. Let our dear military be assured that they will never be used to represent evil, instead to protect law and order.
The people need to know what you will do with the taxes they are paying-the poor roads, our telephone system, electricity, markets, hospitals and water . Strongly affirm to all that the paid taxes will neither be abused nor corrupted. Tell the people how the economy can be stabled, Food and other basic commodities must be well elaborated on. The different tribes like to see no isolation, superiority and tribalism of any sort.
The different religion leaders and their followers need to see tolerance and maintenance of the long peace that Muslims and christians enjoyed in our dear Gambia. The private sector too need to see what Gov't can do for them. Preach for peace, love and tolerance -never hatred and intolerance. Define the rules clearly and help the people know how the Gambian Gov't will interact with other countries of this one world. Counter the opponent genuinely with his evils, wrongs, mistakes and short-sightedness.
Our dear coalition, to bring all the above to fruitful existence, strong commitments and endeavors are needed. Indeed, the task of total democracy has just began. We won't view you as a party monopolised or influenced by any of the member parties but rather a peaceful NADD party coming to rescue our dear Gambia. There will be of course no easy way to getting all these accomplished but with strong faith in Almighty God and total commitment from all members, the coalition will be successful.
Our dear coalition, as i end this letter, i pray for all Gambians at home and abroad. I ask all to respect law and order. I ask all to learn wisdom and apply it at all times. I call on our many brothers and sisters at home and abroad to support the coalition both morally and finally, for when victory comes, everyone will have a share of the cake. This struggle reminds me saying of the wise, S.M.O Aka who said "no matter how dark the night is, day must come". Since i cannot pin the credit on certain individuals but would rather say all the coalition pillars, i once more congratulate and thank you for a job well done. LONG LIVE THE GAMBIA AND LONG LIVE OUR COALITION..ameen.
yj
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"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2010 : 22:26:50
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Part VI
The last chapter of the NADD agreement, which read as follows:
quote:
"We do not seek change for the sake of change. We do not seek power for its sake. Personality for personal interest is not our interest. The issue of interest for NADD is the Gambia, and her people. What is paramount is the national interest. Our duty is to change a system of governance, that is increasingly centralizing the power in the hands of the executive, and replace it with a system that will not allow patronage, sectionalism, tribalism, or self perpetuating rule. For example, the authority of the people cannot bar them from changing their manner of Government, whenever they deem it prudent to do so. NADD stands for the future that will place your country right into your sovereign hands. NADD aims to utilize public power, derived from your authority to safeguard the peoples' liberty, dignity, and prosperity. After forty one years of Independence, the Gambia and her people deserve nothing else."
yj |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2010 : 02:45:40
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Thanks shaka
Let’s give Mbay the chance to answer the questions you raised.
You are very right, we should be mindful not to mistake human nature for tribalism; hence “envy” is human and not necessarily tribalist in spite of our personal experience(s). However, even whereas envy is human nature it is prompted by different circumstances and for different reasons. Tribalism is an immediate object to fall back onto in the absence of something to occupy both the mind and time.
It is not a question of Mr. Politician shouldering the burden of society as such, that would be asking for the impossible, rather it is an effort in the outlining of the political task, in other words an opinion as to the way forward.
So the point is, if Mr. Politician does not remedy the political vacuum, a circumstance in which tribalism could be an escapist tool, with some substance, a budget proposition if you may, that would engage the minds and time of supporters and sway them from taking the easy way out, what is then left to fill the vacuum with, if not the banalities of tribalism, envy and corruption which has been the case up to now.
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Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
Edited by - Janko on 13 Jan 2010 03:29:48 |
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2010 : 03:34:26
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Thanks, Dalton1
When was the article in Part V written? |
Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2010 : 04:27:13
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http://allgambian.net/opinion_12.html
Hi Bro Janko,
The article was written and published prior to July 4th 2004, the official launching for NADD in Atl. (GA).
I attended the summit in ATL. for the launching as well.
Thanks. I will conclude soon.
yj |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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