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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Mar 2006 : 17:21:03
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Lets not take the moral high ground........
I have heard of ambulance staff and nursing staff stealing off patients in UK....... also police! At one big accident near York a couples camera was stolen. (They both died in the accident) The camera had very precious photos of them at a family christening. It was never returned......so someone in the emergency services had that! How greedy and immoral.
In ALL countries in ALL walks of life there are dishonest people and opportunists. Perhaps when you are poor and desperate you learn to be more opportunistic.......... NOT an EXCUSE...but an EXPLANATION.
In any emergency my instinct would be to HELP.......but then I am not desperate. If I was desperate I would like to think I would still help......but unless put to the test who knows? Perhaps survival kicks in?! |
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Formby
United Kingdom
246 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2006 : 17:25:46
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Ok, so what is 'desperation'? I really do just want to explore this. Is it abject, starving poverty, is it having less than somebody else?
And am also quite interested in why people excuse this behaviour by wealth disparity in gambians but would not if it happened in Europe, despite the fact that wealth disparities exist within europe too. |
Edited by - Formby on 08 Mar 2006 17:31:17 |
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kiwi
Sweden
662 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2006 : 22:09:16
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| I wouldn“t say that poverty+crime walks hand in hand but money and greed - or managing directors hold hands. They give each others salaries of millions and millions but they never have enough. It might not be illegal but immoral. Sometimes they go too far and are prosecuted. When asked to witness, they always back up each other by pleaing same disease:loss of memory. |
kiwi |
Edited by - kiwi on 08 Mar 2006 22:34:43 |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2006 : 23:30:22
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Desperation is hard to quantify.....we saw it in New Orleans.....when people had no water or food they were prepared to steal for it.
I would say it is when you get to survival point......starvation, dehydration.......sick children to provide for....etc.....
It is NOT about just wanting someone elses stuff.......that is just pure criminal whatever country it is in. |
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twinkly
United Kingdom
190 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 09:23:19
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We can not compare Europe with Africa, Formby.
It's easy to say we have people who live in poverty.Let me tell you something.
I lived in Gambia before moving to the UK.I've lived with the people, no supermarkets, no special treatment.I've learnt to live very basic.
When I was in UK, I lived the same.I didn't go and claim benefits for ages, because I didn't want to use the system,after all, I am not British.I've lived on 20£ a week, buying everything from that.You won't believe that,I know.
I never felt poor, because I knew that I managed before, in Gambia, without all these material things.My kids didn't get toys, no treats.....and they are still happy children.
I'm just trying to show that we have a completely different way of thinking.When we don't have money, we think we are poor.We are a spoilt, wasting society.Even now, I can easily live without money, as long as we have food.
Being homeless in Europe is a rarety.Having to starve in Europe is unheard of.If we get ill, we will most likely get treatment.And you wanna tell me we are poor? |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 09:29:12
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We arent poor in the ABSOLUTE sense, but there are many RELATIVELY poor people..... go to any inner city council estate.....
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twinkly
United Kingdom
190 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 10:01:26
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I live in a deprived area of London, but I don't see any poor people, I see a material-minded, spoilt society, who doesn't really know how hard life can be.We are very fortunate, having been born into the wealthy part of this world.
How can we say we are poor, just because maybe this month we can't afford some new clothes, or we have to save up to pay a bill, or maybe we can't go on holiday this year..........even in poorer places in Europe, unless somebody is homeless, he will probably not understand what it means to have NOTHING.
I just remember now, I didn't have a washing machine here for more than 8 months.Hmm, I have a bathtub, and soap, and muscles to work.....No spare money to go to the launderette.Oh, I was so poor I have to admit though, that I had problems keeping up with the washing (only 3 people), it is one of the toughest jobs to do physically |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 10:19:57
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So, how did you manage to live on 20£ a week with two children?
I still don“t get it.
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twinkly
United Kingdom
190 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 10:59:01
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Food is very cheap here, just cooking at home, no restaurants, no take aways....
What else did we need?
I'm not saying it was easy, but once you get over the material mind, and you understand that you can live without that certain thing, it is possible.And now I see I'm still alive, nobody suffered from that time and I haven't missed out on anything |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 11:26:19
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Wow, that“s really amazing! You could write a book about it. |
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twinkly
United Kingdom
190 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 12:09:58
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80% of our worldpopulation has probably more experience and knowledge about what it really means to be poor.I just had a nibble, after all, I can still return to my comfortable Europe anytime
Anyway, lets get back to the topic, sorry |
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Formby
United Kingdom
246 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 12:39:27
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Am still very interested to get behind the reasons why people defend such acts from Gambians...
I will draw my own conclusions. |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 12:40:09
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quote:
Originally posted by kiwi01
I wouldn“t say that poverty+crime walks hand in hand but money and greed - or managing directors hold hands. They give each others salaries of millions and millions but they never have enough. It might not be illegal but immoral. Sometimes they go too far and are prosecuted. When asked to witness, they always back up each other by pleaing same disease:loss of memory.
In my opinion, poverty and crime is nothing new. Poverty can lead to desperation, either it is for the sake of survival or just plain and simple greedyness. I think we all heard of some ghettokids kill someone because of his Nike“s and things like that.
Then there are the streetkids in poor countries who have to survive somehow, and crime is the only way because there is no other choise.
Brazil is a good example. (And the government take these kids to the bush and shoot them like dogs.)
But no doubt about that the most greedy people are the ones on top positions, the African leaders are one good example. They don“t even try to hide it, everyone can see what they“re up to.
Whilst here in the west some rich people handle their monkey business behind closed doors, and they operate very smoothly. They“re not out on the streets, but they mug and fool people in a more sofisticated way.
Crimes in different disguise, yet basically the same. |
Edited by - Babylon on 09 Mar 2006 12:47:21 |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 13:19:23
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| Not it isnt the same...that sort of crime may hurt people in the pocket, but it doesnt do physical or mental harm in the same way as say a rape or mugging..... |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2006 : 13:50:04
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Maybe not physical harm, but in the long term mental harm -yes. I think that is possible.
If we look at the situation for many people in Africa, we can see that the greedy leaders have played a big role in the people“s life. The bad decisions of their leaders directly affects them everyday.
I believe one must be mentally strong to cope such injustices.
And I think mental harm can cause physical harm in the long term, when there“s no hope in life you may become self destructive.
What some rich dude here does to gain more money from the taxpayers is another thing. That doesn“t really affect our lives, more than we might get a little angry.
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Edited by - Babylon on 09 Mar 2006 14:03:04 |
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