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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
 Posted - 07 May 2007 : 09:31:36
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I was just asking :) anyway. I read the history of WW1 and familiar with Turkish history. One reason Ottoman lost the war was we had to fight in southern front against arabs and their gay friend lawrance. And there are several other reasons for the fall. We can discuss it under another topic.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2007 : 09:31:36
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I was just asking :) anyway. I read the history of WW1 and familiar with Turkish history. One reason Ottoman lost the war was we had to fight in southern front against arabs and their gay friend lawrance. And there are several other reasons for the fall. We can discuss it under another topic.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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rassimian
United Kingdom
168 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2007 : 13:11:28
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Wow 'arabs and their gay ( presumably meaning homosexual) friend Lawrance' Must have been an unholy alliance then !
Unfortunately Turkey has yet to come to terms with its own history, in particular the 'Armenian' question. |
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rassimian
United Kingdom
168 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2007 : 13:11:28
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Wow 'arabs and their gay ( presumably meaning homosexual) friend Lawrance' Must have been an unholy alliance then !
Unfortunately Turkey has yet to come to terms with its own history, in particular the 'Armenian' question. |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2007 : 23:59:03
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that is a historical fact. English spy Lawrance was homosexual. His obsession with arab men is well know. Did you think a british man was helping arabs in the name of freedom?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T._E._Lawrence
for your confusion about gay and homosexuallity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay
rassimian. Sorry but you lost me there. How is the armenian question come up here? However, I would love to answer your questions if you open a new topic discussing the biggest crimes of the humanity including Armenian question and
- Native American Holocoust by European Settlers (mostly british)
- Slavery trade by british
- Colonization of Africa and India for centuries
And please answer my question. As you pointed out that Turkey has yet to come to terms with its own history, in particular the 'Armenian' question. Before we discuss this, do you think UK has paid any compensation in terms of the crimes against humanity mentioned above. For example, did UK paid any compensation to the Gambia or come to the terms with Gambia?
For example, it is hypocracy by French parliement does nothing about their role during Algerian war during 1960s while they are so motivated about armenian questions.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 08 May 2007 04:24:13 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2007 : 23:59:03
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that is a historical fact. English spy Lawrance was homosexual. His obsession with arab men is well know. Did you think a british man was helping arabs in the name of freedom?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T._E._Lawrence
for your confusion about gay and homosexuallity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay
rassimian. Sorry but you lost me there. How is the armenian question come up here? However, I would love to answer your questions if you open a new topic discussing the biggest crimes of the humanity including Armenian question and
- Native American Holocoust by European Settlers (mostly british)
- Slavery trade by british
- Colonization of Africa and India for centuries
And please answer my question. As you pointed out that Turkey has yet to come to terms with its own history, in particular the 'Armenian' question. Before we discuss this, do you think UK has paid any compensation in terms of the crimes against humanity mentioned above. For example, did UK paid any compensation to the Gambia or come to the terms with Gambia?
For example, it is hypocracy by French parliement does nothing about their role during Algerian war during 1960s while they are so motivated about armenian questions.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 08 May 2007 04:24:13 |
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Lily
United Kingdom
422 Posts |
Posted - 08 May 2007 : 00:09:07
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Turk, hi
Do you think Lawerence's homosexuality might have deprived him of reason or sensibility? ? Why might it not be possible for him - a British man - to help Arabs? To be absolutely accurate: he wasn't a spy - everyone knew he was there ....
I don't think someone's nationality - or sexuality -precludes them from wanting to help others.
Whilst almost certainly from a particular point of view, almost everything I've ever read about Lawrence indicates he was a man of (perhaps misguided) honour.... |
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Lily
United Kingdom
422 Posts |
Posted - 08 May 2007 : 00:09:07
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Turk, hi
Do you think Lawerence's homosexuality might have deprived him of reason or sensibility? ? Why might it not be possible for him - a British man - to help Arabs? To be absolutely accurate: he wasn't a spy - everyone knew he was there ....
I don't think someone's nationality - or sexuality -precludes them from wanting to help others.
Whilst almost certainly from a particular point of view, almost everything I've ever read about Lawrence indicates he was a man of (perhaps misguided) honour.... |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 08 May 2007 : 00:16:21
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Possible. I know many brits today they would sincerely help. But in that times it is unlikely. Reasons
He was spy. He was there for the interest of British Empire. He was military officer. A military officer has duty to fight for their country. That time, it was british interests to divide ottoman empire. So Lawrance was not fighting for arabs. He was fighting for British Empire. If I was lawrance I would do the same thing. Plus his homosexually was additional personal incentive.
Second reason would be. We are talking british during colonization times and WW1 here. That time brit's main motivation is their political interest. Brits were fighting against Ottoman. They cheated them they would give them freedom but later they colonized Arabs. Today still Brits are sucking arabic oil because of lawrance. For their political interests they would do anything. For example, they did not mind the massacre of native american (millions of people we are talking here) for natural resources and space for their immigrants. So when you look at British history, brits don't help noone if there is no interests.
And even today, I hope you will not give me example as brits in iraq now for helping iraqi people.
Anyway the reason I brought lawrance because santafara mentioned why ottoman decline. One reason was the islamic connection he proud was broken by arabs by helping brits against their umma.
p.s. I am answering all these questions, but may I remind contributors that we are discussing gambia here. Perhaps we should open another topic to discuss ottomans if there are interests.
Here is the question for you. Do you think Lawrance would help arabs after they are colonized by brits? I am looking forward for your answer.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 08 May 2007 01:44:08 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 08 May 2007 : 00:16:21
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Possible. I know many brits today they would sincerely help. But in that times it is unlikely. Reasons
He was spy. He was there for the interest of British Empire. He was military officer. A military officer has duty to fight for their country. That time, it was british interests to divide ottoman empire. So Lawrance was not fighting for arabs. He was fighting for British Empire. If I was lawrance I would do the same thing. Plus his homosexually was additional personal incentive.
Second reason would be. We are talking british during colonization times and WW1 here. That time brit's main motivation is their political interest. Brits were fighting against Ottoman. They cheated them they would give them freedom but later they colonized Arabs. Today still Brits are sucking arabic oil because of lawrance. For their political interests they would do anything. For example, they did not mind the massacre of native american (millions of people we are talking here) for natural resources and space for their immigrants. So when you look at British history, brits don't help noone if there is no interests.
And even today, I hope you will not give me example as brits in iraq now for helping iraqi people.
Anyway the reason I brought lawrance because santafara mentioned why ottoman decline. One reason was the islamic connection he proud was broken by arabs by helping brits against their umma.
p.s. I am answering all these questions, but may I remind contributors that we are discussing gambia here. Perhaps we should open another topic to discuss ottomans if there are interests.
Here is the question for you. Do you think Lawrance would help arabs after they are colonized by brits? I am looking forward for your answer.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 08 May 2007 01:44:08 |
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mbay
Germany
1007 Posts |
Posted - 10 May 2007 : 10:01:25
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Islamic state ? it will bring nothing at all if one don't believe from hart and mind and burden for our none muslim followers.
What we need is tolerance and unity as well as respect for one another including none muslim.
what the tourist=none muslim most accept (what seems to be the case)is that majority of us are Muslim we are no different with the western world if it comes to respect a countries rules
quote:
Originally posted by gambiabev
What would be the advantages and disadvantages?
What would the impact be on the tourist trade?
How does Mansula feel about people from other countries that are non Islamic being free to enter Gambia at will? Do you think there should be a visa requirement?
How would you deal with people living in Gambia that arent Islamic? Would you expect them to live by the same rules? Or would you expect them to leave the country? or what? eg Rastas or christians?
What would an Islamic states attitude be to NGO helping tha arent Islamic? Would they be allowed in the country or asked to leave?
There are lots of things to think about.
What about dress codes? Alcohol prohibition etc etc
I would like to hear more about how Mansula envisages an Islamic state in Gambia and I would like to hear other Gambians comments about it.
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mbay
Germany
1007 Posts |
Posted - 10 May 2007 : 10:01:25
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Islamic state ? it will bring nothing at all if one don't believe from hart and mind and burden for our none muslim followers.
What we need is tolerance and unity as well as respect for one another including none muslim.
what the tourist=none muslim most accept (what seems to be the case)is that majority of us are Muslim we are no different with the western world if it comes to respect a countries rules
quote:
Originally posted by gambiabev
What would be the advantages and disadvantages?
What would the impact be on the tourist trade?
How does Mansula feel about people from other countries that are non Islamic being free to enter Gambia at will? Do you think there should be a visa requirement?
How would you deal with people living in Gambia that arent Islamic? Would you expect them to live by the same rules? Or would you expect them to leave the country? or what? eg Rastas or christians?
What would an Islamic states attitude be to NGO helping tha arent Islamic? Would they be allowed in the country or asked to leave?
There are lots of things to think about.
What about dress codes? Alcohol prohibition etc etc
I would like to hear more about how Mansula envisages an Islamic state in Gambia and I would like to hear other Gambians comments about it.
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Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 10 May 2007 : 14:06:33
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quote:
Originally posted by turk
Possible. I know many brits today they would sincerely help. But in that times it is unlikely. Reasons
He was spy. He was there for the interest of British Empire. He was military officer. A military officer has duty to fight for their country. That time, it was british interests to divide ottoman empire. So Lawrance was not fighting for arabs. He was fighting for British Empire. If I was lawrance I would do the same thing. Plus his homosexually was additional personal incentive.
Second reason would be. We are talking british during colonization times and WW1 here. That time brit's main motivation is their political interest. Brits were fighting against Ottoman. They cheated them they would give them freedom but later they colonized Arabs. Today still Brits are sucking arabic oil because of lawrance. For their political interests they would do anything. For example, they did not mind the massacre of native american (millions of people we are talking here) for natural resources and space for their immigrants. So when you look at British history, brits don't help noone if there is no interests.
And even today, I hope you will not give me example as brits in iraq now for helping iraqi people.
Anyway the reason I brought lawrance because santafara mentioned why ottoman decline. One reason was the islamic connection he proud was broken by arabs by helping brits against their umma.
p.s. I am answering all these questions, but may I remind contributors that we are discussing gambia here. Perhaps we should open another topic to discuss ottomans if there are interests.
Here is the question for you. Do you think Lawrance would help arabs after they are colonized by brits? I am looking forward for your answer.
turk , the personality figure of lawrence is covered in mystery . he was indeed misled by his superiors which he himself admitted. so it is going to be long drawn out answer. people like lawrence where indeed good soldeirs but his number one goal was for '' QUEEN AND COUNTRY '' just like today's wars . he was a comarflage agent .his roles are similar with the JETSUIT operations .i mean they come as peace makers whilst acting with very high authority to achieve the interest of there state. you can see this type of people in most ngo organisations .the ngo came out at a time when many start suspecting the role of military aid workers .lawrence sexuality came to light much later after the whole war was over .but it is hard for any one to prove that he was homosexual .
how did lawrence died ? well ,this is another mystery .so some times we leave certain things the way they are .he died of a motocycle accident ,but was it an accident ? this world is full of mysteries .the arabs wanted out of the ottoman rule at all cost so they fail to see the bigger picture .again the saudis wanted to recapture there position in the muslim world .britain and the u.s played a key role in that becomig a reality . pls turk avoid using explicit languages to discredit lawrence .i don't know him but they said he was gutted and guilty for his role in the GRAND ARAB DECEPTION ,so after the war he became depress .lots of people died . |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
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Santanfara
3460 Posts |
Posted - 10 May 2007 : 14:06:33
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quote:
Originally posted by turk
Possible. I know many brits today they would sincerely help. But in that times it is unlikely. Reasons
He was spy. He was there for the interest of British Empire. He was military officer. A military officer has duty to fight for their country. That time, it was british interests to divide ottoman empire. So Lawrance was not fighting for arabs. He was fighting for British Empire. If I was lawrance I would do the same thing. Plus his homosexually was additional personal incentive.
Second reason would be. We are talking british during colonization times and WW1 here. That time brit's main motivation is their political interest. Brits were fighting against Ottoman. They cheated them they would give them freedom but later they colonized Arabs. Today still Brits are sucking arabic oil because of lawrance. For their political interests they would do anything. For example, they did not mind the massacre of native american (millions of people we are talking here) for natural resources and space for their immigrants. So when you look at British history, brits don't help noone if there is no interests.
And even today, I hope you will not give me example as brits in iraq now for helping iraqi people.
Anyway the reason I brought lawrance because santafara mentioned why ottoman decline. One reason was the islamic connection he proud was broken by arabs by helping brits against their umma.
p.s. I am answering all these questions, but may I remind contributors that we are discussing gambia here. Perhaps we should open another topic to discuss ottomans if there are interests.
Here is the question for you. Do you think Lawrance would help arabs after they are colonized by brits? I am looking forward for your answer.
turk , the personality figure of lawrence is covered in mystery . he was indeed misled by his superiors which he himself admitted. so it is going to be long drawn out answer. people like lawrence where indeed good soldeirs but his number one goal was for '' QUEEN AND COUNTRY '' just like today's wars . he was a comarflage agent .his roles are similar with the JETSUIT operations .i mean they come as peace makers whilst acting with very high authority to achieve the interest of there state. you can see this type of people in most ngo organisations .the ngo came out at a time when many start suspecting the role of military aid workers .lawrence sexuality came to light much later after the whole war was over .but it is hard for any one to prove that he was homosexual .
how did lawrence died ? well ,this is another mystery .so some times we leave certain things the way they are .he died of a motocycle accident ,but was it an accident ? this world is full of mysteries .the arabs wanted out of the ottoman rule at all cost so they fail to see the bigger picture .again the saudis wanted to recapture there position in the muslim world .britain and the u.s played a key role in that becomig a reality . pls turk avoid using explicit languages to discredit lawrence .i don't know him but they said he was gutted and guilty for his role in the GRAND ARAB DECEPTION ,so after the war he became depress .lots of people died . |
Surah- Ar-Rum 30-22
"And among His signs is the creation of heavens and the earth, and the difference of your languages and colours. verily, in that are indeed signs for men of sound knowledge." Qu'ran
www.suntoumana.blogspot.com |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2007 : 00:41:37
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pls turk avoid using explicit languages to discredit lawrence!!!1
Is 'gay' explicit? |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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