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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
 Posted - 04 May 2007 : 20:06:16
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What would be the advantages and disadvantages?
What would the impact be on the tourist trade?
How does Mansula feel about people from other countries that are non Islamic being free to enter Gambia at will? Do you think there should be a visa requirement?
How would you deal with people living in Gambia that arent Islamic? Would you expect them to live by the same rules? Or would you expect them to leave the country? or what? eg Rastas or christians?
What would an Islamic states attitude be to NGO helping tha arent Islamic? Would they be allowed in the country or asked to leave?
There are lots of things to think about.
What about dress codes? Alcohol prohibition etc etc
I would like to hear more about how Mansula envisages an Islamic state in Gambia and I would like to hear other Gambians comments about it.
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 20:32:47
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Mansasulu,
This is a clear ground to cultivate the seeds of Islamic Gambia. You can build on from the current stand of Gambian Muslims by name. Just like British Christians by name, any regime seeking to make Britain exclusively Christian State will begin the fight with those whose names are John, Peter, Michael, Brian, Anne, Mary, Joseph. The reason is because, after bearing these names, many will tell you how less often they ever get to the Church doorstep. May be this is not in the same proportion with Gambians, but a good number continue to deviate the principles and good practices of Islam. From this platform here, those who feel different about this observation are free to come up. A good point raised by Gambiabev pertaining tourism is worth considering. Although badly managed, tourism is still a basket of economic hope for many Gambians. It may not mean non Muslims choosing not going to Gambia. There are other issues. There is no doubt that in true Islamic faith, the Creator Almighty Allah is merciful and gracious. |
Karamba |
Edited by - Karamba on 05 May 2007 01:00:21 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 20:32:47
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Mansasulu,
This is a clear ground to cultivate the seeds of Islamic Gambia. You can build on from the current stand of Gambian Muslims by name. Just like British Christians by name, any regime seeking to make Britain exclusively Christian State will begin the fight with those whose names are John, Peter, Michael, Brian, Anne, Mary, Joseph. The reason is because, after bearing these names, many will tell you how less often they ever get to the Church doorstep. May be this is not in the same proportion with Gambians, but a good number continue to deviate the principles and good practices of Islam. From this platform here, those who feel different about this observation are free to come up. A good point raised by Gambiabev pertaining tourism is worth considering. Although badly managed, tourism is still a basket of economic hope for many Gambians. It may not mean non Muslims choosing not going to Gambia. There are other issues. There is no doubt that in true Islamic faith, the Creator Almighty Allah is merciful and gracious. |
Karamba |
Edited by - Karamba on 05 May 2007 01:00:21 |
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Karl
136 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 23:11:30
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Just to say well done brothers and sisters. I truely admire your contributions and involvements in an open platform or bantaba to exchange ideas and engage one another on various topics opened for debate. These topics are educative am sure to all those who follow this forum one way or the other. I must say bravo to you all particularly individuals like Karamba, Ebou4th, mansasulu. Kobo, gambiabev, sister omega, Momodou and many others not mentioned. Well done to you all, keep it up, lets continue to share knowledge and experience. " The use of Knowledge is power" and surely sooner or later these little contributions you are all making will materialised and empower us all as Gambians home and abroad, in our diverse people to prove mans brotherhood. One day no matter different opinions we will surely benefit from the fruits of this forum on a higher ground in the entire political and social life of the Gambia our motherland.
I have been a keen follower of this forum and will continue to do so. I hope i will be able to contribute more in the future. Thanks
Karl |
"People who shut their eyes to reality simply invite their own destruction, and anyone who insists on remaining in a state of innocence long after that innocence is dead turns himself into a monster" J Baldwin |
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Karl
136 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 23:11:30
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Just to say well done brothers and sisters. I truely admire your contributions and involvements in an open platform or bantaba to exchange ideas and engage one another on various topics opened for debate. These topics are educative am sure to all those who follow this forum one way or the other. I must say bravo to you all particularly individuals like Karamba, Ebou4th, mansasulu. Kobo, gambiabev, sister omega, Momodou and many others not mentioned. Well done to you all, keep it up, lets continue to share knowledge and experience. " The use of Knowledge is power" and surely sooner or later these little contributions you are all making will materialised and empower us all as Gambians home and abroad, in our diverse people to prove mans brotherhood. One day no matter different opinions we will surely benefit from the fruits of this forum on a higher ground in the entire political and social life of the Gambia our motherland.
I have been a keen follower of this forum and will continue to do so. I hope i will be able to contribute more in the future. Thanks
Karl |
"People who shut their eyes to reality simply invite their own destruction, and anyone who insists on remaining in a state of innocence long after that innocence is dead turns himself into a monster" J Baldwin |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 23:48:27
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Please contribute. We all learn from each other. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2007 : 23:48:27
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| Please contribute. We all learn from each other. |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 03:41:45
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Or one may ask:
What would be the advantages and disadvantages of NON-ISLAMIC STATE?
What would the impact be on the tourist trade? IS TOURISM SECTOR GOOD FOR GAMBIA?
How does Mansula feel about people from other countries that are non Islamic being free to enter Gambia at will? Do you think there should be a visa requirement? HOW DOES GAMBIABEV FEEL ABOUT PEOPLE FROM AFRICA BEING FREE TO ENTER UK AT WILL? DO YOU THINK THERE SHOULD NOT BE A VISA REQUIREMENT FOR AFRICANS COMING TO UK?
How would you deal with people living in Gambia that arent Islamic? Would you expect them to live by the same rules? Or would you expect them to leave the country? or what? eg Rastas or christians? HOW WOULD YOU DEAL WITH PEOPLE LIVING IN UK THAT ARE NOT WHITE. WOULD YOU EXPECT THEM TO LIVE BY THE SAME RULES? WOULD YOU EXPECT THEM TO LEAVE THE COUNTRY? MUSLIMS, AFRICANS, MIDDLEEASTERN?
What would an Islamic states attitude be to NGO helping tha arent Islamic? HOW WOULD UK STATES ATTITUTE BE TO MUSLIMS WHO HELP MUSLIM ORGANIZATIONS LIKE HAMAS? Would they be allowed in the country or asked to leave?
There are lots of things to think about.
What about dress codes? Alcohol prohibition etc etc. WHY DOES UK ALLOW ALCOHOL CONSUMPTION TO BE FREE WHILE GANJA IS NOT, OR SMOKING IS NOT? WHY CANADIAN GOVERNMENT ALLOWS ALCOHOL CONSUMPTION ONLY ON LICENCED RESTAURANTS AND HOME?
I would like to hear more about how Mansula envisages an Islamic state in Gambia and I would like to hear other Gambians comments about it.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 05 May 2007 04:07:49 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 03:41:45
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Or one may ask:
What would be the advantages and disadvantages of NON-ISLAMIC STATE?
What would the impact be on the tourist trade? IS TOURISM SECTOR GOOD FOR GAMBIA?
How does Mansula feel about people from other countries that are non Islamic being free to enter Gambia at will? Do you think there should be a visa requirement? HOW DOES GAMBIABEV FEEL ABOUT PEOPLE FROM AFRICA BEING FREE TO ENTER UK AT WILL? DO YOU THINK THERE SHOULD NOT BE A VISA REQUIREMENT FOR AFRICANS COMING TO UK?
How would you deal with people living in Gambia that arent Islamic? Would you expect them to live by the same rules? Or would you expect them to leave the country? or what? eg Rastas or christians? HOW WOULD YOU DEAL WITH PEOPLE LIVING IN UK THAT ARE NOT WHITE. WOULD YOU EXPECT THEM TO LIVE BY THE SAME RULES? WOULD YOU EXPECT THEM TO LEAVE THE COUNTRY? MUSLIMS, AFRICANS, MIDDLEEASTERN?
What would an Islamic states attitude be to NGO helping tha arent Islamic? HOW WOULD UK STATES ATTITUTE BE TO MUSLIMS WHO HELP MUSLIM ORGANIZATIONS LIKE HAMAS? Would they be allowed in the country or asked to leave?
There are lots of things to think about.
What about dress codes? Alcohol prohibition etc etc. WHY DOES UK ALLOW ALCOHOL CONSUMPTION TO BE FREE WHILE GANJA IS NOT, OR SMOKING IS NOT? WHY CANADIAN GOVERNMENT ALLOWS ALCOHOL CONSUMPTION ONLY ON LICENCED RESTAURANTS AND HOME?
I would like to hear more about how Mansula envisages an Islamic state in Gambia and I would like to hear other Gambians comments about it.
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diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 05 May 2007 04:07:49 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 04:01:18
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Most important question;
Can UK (31,400 per capita) maintain democracy and secularism, order of law if UK was one of 50 poorest countrIES in the world? Or how would UK deal with STD or drug use, if UK was poorest country in the world?
Problems are good opportunities for different solutions that are based on different realities. Let us face it. Gambia is not rich. People are broke. In a western country, if someone is broke, he or she go to welfare agency get some money, shelter etc. I think, for this case, islamic values can provide better solutions than western system in Gambia. I am not promoting Islamic state or reject the islamic state. My point is Gambia must have a system based on its realties. Last time I checked majority is muslim, so islam being an alternative to some of the problems Gambia makes sense to me. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 05 May 2007 04:15:47 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 04:01:18
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Most important question;
Can UK (31,400 per capita) maintain democracy and secularism, order of law if UK was one of 50 poorest countrIES in the world? Or how would UK deal with STD or drug use, if UK was poorest country in the world?
Problems are good opportunities for different solutions that are based on different realities. Let us face it. Gambia is not rich. People are broke. In a western country, if someone is broke, he or she go to welfare agency get some money, shelter etc. I think, for this case, islamic values can provide better solutions than western system in Gambia. I am not promoting Islamic state or reject the islamic state. My point is Gambia must have a system based on its realties. Last time I checked majority is muslim, so islam being an alternative to some of the problems Gambia makes sense to me. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 05 May 2007 04:15:47 |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 11:27:57
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Turk your reply is a clever one, but I am not proposing a WHITE UK Or a CHRISTIAN UK, that belongs to the past not the future of the UK.
I am happy for anyone who comes and works and contributes to the society to be part of that society. If they are peaceful I am happy to let them live in peace and practice whatever religion they choose.
For Gambia to progress it needs to create more paid work for its people and then they would contribute through taxes to improve the schools and medical care.
If as an Islamic state people would be against tourism and drinking then other sources of employment and income would need to be found. What do you envisage as an alternative?
Turk there is a big difference between most people being moderate Muslims and then deciding to make an Islmic state of Gambia.
I love the Gambian people for their moderate nature and their kindness. Would they vote for an Islamic state? Ir woudl it be imposed on them? If so by who? |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 11:27:57
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Turk your reply is a clever one, but I am not proposing a WHITE UK Or a CHRISTIAN UK, that belongs to the past not the future of the UK.
I am happy for anyone who comes and works and contributes to the society to be part of that society. If they are peaceful I am happy to let them live in peace and practice whatever religion they choose.
For Gambia to progress it needs to create more paid work for its people and then they would contribute through taxes to improve the schools and medical care.
If as an Islamic state people would be against tourism and drinking then other sources of employment and income would need to be found. What do you envisage as an alternative?
Turk there is a big difference between most people being moderate Muslims and then deciding to make an Islmic state of Gambia.
I love the Gambian people for their moderate nature and their kindness. Would they vote for an Islamic state? Ir woudl it be imposed on them? If so by who? |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 16:22:34
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False Muslims, False Muslims. That is the truth about many in Gambia. Jammeh dressing up like Imam and holding the magic stick 24 hours makes one wonder what it is that he believes. His dress is Islamic in appearance but his handling of national resources and treatment of the citizenry is prohibited by all clean religions of this world. Yet, even some Imams in Gambia pretend they are not bothered about the open inhumane activities of a leader who preaches Islam and performs the devil. |
Karamba |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 16:22:34
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False Muslims, False Muslims. That is the truth about many in Gambia. Jammeh dressing up like Imam and holding the magic stick 24 hours makes one wonder what it is that he believes. His dress is Islamic in appearance but his handling of national resources and treatment of the citizenry is prohibited by all clean religions of this world. Yet, even some Imams in Gambia pretend they are not bothered about the open inhumane activities of a leader who preaches Islam and performs the devil. |
Karamba |
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Nyarikangbanna
United Kingdom
1382 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2007 : 19:45:34
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[quote]Originally posted by turk
Most important question;
Can UK (31,400 per capita) maintain democracy and secularism, order of law if UK was one of 50 poorest countrIES in the world? Or how would UK deal with STD or drug use, if UK was poorest country in the world?
I once posited in a tutorial debate that UK is secular but I was debunked by the tutor who clearly stated that UK is not a secular state but officially a Christian state. I found truth in this from a historical context and given that the Queen in her capacity as head of state [not in her personal capacity] is the official head of the Church of England. So I think we are better of describing UK as a multicultural society rather than a secular state. Having said that, I think the whole idea of 'Islamic Republic of Gambia' is inconceivable for the simple reason that despite our majority status, Muslims alone don't own Gambia. Ever since Gambia was found in 1888 until independence in 1965, it has always being a country of mild religious diversity.
Ownership in itself is a right. So if Gambian Muslims can claim ownership over Gambia, Christians too can do it and we have no right to stop them from claiming entitlement, as long as they are not talking about a Christian entitlement, since they too are Gambians. So this is a co-ownership. The minority cannot be deprived of that right and certainly there is no right of Muslim entitlement to Gambia.
The Constitution has provided a right to religious Freedom and this has being universally observed and respect. Therefore those who want to be good Muslims have every right and opportunity to be so. That being the case, there is no need to establish an Islamic state.
Unless we want to do away with our culture of religious tolerance and turn to injustice, social persecution, barbarism and aggression, I think this debate is perverse.
Just my thoughts.
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I do not oppose unity but I oppose dumb union. |
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