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dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
 Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 18:38:52
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Debra, am not sure what State you are in, but many Gambian ladies has embraced baby shawer here in the U.S. In the state of Washington the ladies have commercialized it. It has become a tradition for the ladies to hold baby shawer for all pregnant women in the community.
In the late 1990s the ladies used to buy tons of baby materials ranging from baby crips, blankets, clothes, car seats, baby toys and most importantly baby diapers. After our first born in 2000 it took us a year before we had to buy almost anything. It was very helpful.
That great support from the ladies in the community has now turn to be a commercial expedition. The ladies here now contribute between $50 - $150 for each baby shawer. Some of them have collected as much as $8,000 from their baby shawers. Off course you are looking at a community of more than 200 ladies within the community. They don't bring materials anymore only the monetary contribution.
Depending on how you look at it, I think it is great for them to support each other at times of needs. The bad thing about it is that you have to give it back which turn out to be a liability. The other thing is that they use that money to buy lots of jury in which case the baby gets forgotten.
I tease my wife when we had the last baby that she should open up an account and save the money there so she can give it back 
By and large it has been a tradition in our community here in the U.S and I would not be suprised if the same thing is taking place in the state you live. You can check with the ladies and see what they do. Hope this little story helps. |
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 18:43:42
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quote:
Originally posted by dbaldeh
Debra, am not sure what State you are in, but many Gambian ladies has embraced baby shawer here in the U.S. In the state of Washington the ladies have commercialized it. It has become a tradition for the ladies to hold baby shawer for all pregnant women in the community.
In the late 1990s the ladies used to buy tons of baby materials ranging from baby crips, blankets, clothes, car seats, baby toys and most importantly baby diapers. After our first born in 2000 it took us a year before we had to buy almost anything. It was very helpful.
That great support from the ladies in the community has now turn to be a commercial expedition. The ladies here now contribute between $50 - $150 for each baby shawer. Some of them have collected as much as $8,000 from their baby shawers. Off course you are looking at a community of more than 200 ladies within the community. They don't bring materials anymore only the monetary contribution.
Depending on how you look at it, I think it is great for them to support each other at times of needs. The bad thing about it is that you have to give it back which turn out to be a liability. The other thing is that they use that money to buy lots of jury in which case the baby gets forgotten.
I tease my wife when we had the last baby that she should open up an account and save the money there so she can give it back
By and large it has been a tradition in our community here in the U.S and I would not be suprised if the same thing is taking place in the state you live. You can check with the ladies and see what they do. Hope this little story helps.
In the Gambian community, the baby showers are exopected to be paid back. They keep the list of all gifts and then sent the same to the other when she has a baby. Its more like a loan and therefore not in agreement with afican spirit of community.
If you dont give the amount of gift back, your name will be all over the community for not rsponding in kind. Even if you had no money at the time, they dont care. you make have to take a loan. It almost self bondage. |
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dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 20:05:43
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I somehow agree Kon that it is out of line with the African tradition atleast on the surface. However, we probably need to be more realistic as we live in a world of materialism. I think it is a plus to have people contribute for you and you in turn contribute when it is their turn. It is progress for people to help each other at the times of needs.
If you carefully study the African tradition of helping each other you will find out that deep inside this notion of given back has always been there. For example, in my tradition when someone is getting married you go around and inform people about it and expect to collect something. In turn, if their time comes you give to them as well either in cash or kind. Even the traditional funeral services in Africa require one to bring something or atleast show up in good gesture if you don't have anything.
Honestly, am all in for everyone chipping in and helping each other. That African tradition of "Monkey works and Baboon eats" has ruined our economic base for so long. How can one person in a family of say 50 people sustain everyone from their mega earnings? It has to be a mutual give and take.
Deeply think about the reasoning behind some of our traditions and you will see the hidden truth that no one talk about, but everyone is aware of it. In the wolof tradition they announce what everyone brings to a families occasion and it is a Mary go round.
It is wired to us but I think it is a healthy thing to do so you don't have the same people always giving and the same receiving without giving back. It encourages interdependency, which is healthy. Do you agree?
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Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
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njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 20:33:17
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quote:
Originally posted by dbaldeh
I somehow agree Kon that it is out of line with the African tradition atleast on the surface.
Baldeh,like Anna you are the only one who has said anything sensible. you first posting was good and the second is eroding most of it. Kondorong & Co are wrong and overreacting. i dont see what english people do or dont do has anything to do with this. as you rightly said , deep inside it has always been there.
if you look at the 'hews' back home, they are no different from showers. one woman has one and her friends/family attend and spend money, when its their turn she does. similar thing.
I think Debra was kindly asking what she could do to extend american hospitality to her friend. if i read correctly she was thinking of organising a party for her friend nothing else. African culture itself is a worng term as it doesnt exist. Africa starts from Cairo to Cape Town. between only god know how many cultures exist.
Debra if you are reading,i must appologise for some of my countryfolk. there are coming from very far places. Yoro Bawol(a settlement) is miles away. and we normally ignore people from there
most gambians are friendly and open minded and will not be offended even when odd things happen. buy whatever you would for any other baby, i can tell you that your gambian friend would appreciate your kindness. i also hope that she would one day return this kind gesture. |
Edited by - njucks on 09 Nov 2006 20:35:40 |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 20:37:31
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quote:
Originally posted by njucks
quote:
Originally posted by dbaldeh
I somehow agree Kon that it is out of line with the African tradition atleast on the surface.
Debra if you are readingi must appologise for some of my countryfolk. [b]there are coming from very far places. Yoro Bawol(a settlement) is miles away. and we normally ignore people from there
I did not know that people in Yoro Bawol are ignored
But the truth is there is no baby shower in Gambian culture across all 9 tribes. Its that simple.
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Edited by - kondorong on 09 Nov 2006 22:41:56 |
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njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 20:45:08
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yeah we do, and i'll make one more exception.
it is not the gambian mother who is doing the shower, its The AMERICAN woman extending part of her culture to her friend.
Its that simple!!!!.
dont we celebrate birthdays in The Gambia (ex Yoro Bawol) and sing HB2U!!!!!! is it gambian??? perhaps a Cool Aid will lighten you up.
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dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 22:04:28
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Thanks Njucks, I think thought sometimes it is necessary to ask the question WHY things are done so we have an understanding how they came about in the first place.
There are so many things that we do and never question why we do them and how they come about. Sometimes simply asking the question can lead to a whole new discovery. Am sure Debra have learned something new about baby showers. Now she has some knowledge how she could help her friend.
Debra, don't be alarmed by the amounts mentioned. Anything your friend will highly appreciate even just by showing up there.
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Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
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debra
5 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 22:37:04
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Thank you verymuch. It is very interesting to learn about each others cultures. Gambians are a very kind and thoughtful people. quote:
Originally posted by dbaldeh
Thanks Njucks, I think thought sometimes it is necessary to ask the question WHY things are done so we have an understanding how they came about in the first place.
There are so many things that we do and never question why we do them and how they come about. Sometimes simply asking the question can lead to a whole new discovery. Am sure Debra have learned something new about baby showers. Now she has some knowledge how she could help her friend.
Debra, don't be alarmed by the amounts mentioned. Anything your friend will highly appreciate even just by showing up there.
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debra
5 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 22:42:05
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I appreciate your kind words. You are very wise. quote:
Originally posted by njucks
quote:
Originally posted by dbaldeh
I somehow agree Kon that it is out of line with the African tradition atleast on the surface.
Baldeh,like Anna you are the only one who has said anything sensible. you first posting was good and the second is eroding most of it. Kondorong & Co are wrong and overreacting. i dont see what english people do or dont do has anything to do with this. as you rightly said , deep inside it has always been there.
if you look at the 'hews' back home, they are no different from showers. one woman has one and her friends/family attend and spend money, when its their turn she does. similar thing.
I think Debra was kindly asking what she could do to extend american hospitality to her friend. if i read correctly she was thinking of organising a party for her friend nothing else. African culture itself is a worng term as it doesnt exist. Africa starts from Cairo to Cape Town. between only god know how many cultures exist.
Debra if you are reading,i must appologise for some of my countryfolk. there are coming from very far places. Yoro Bawol(a settlement) is miles away. and we normally ignore people from there
most gambians are friendly and open minded and will not be offended even when odd things happen. buy whatever you would for any other baby, i can tell you that your gambian friend would appreciate your kindness. i also hope that she would one day return this kind gesture.
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 22:55:18
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quote:
Originally posted by njucks
yeah we do, and i'll make one more exception.
it is not the gambian mother who is doing the shower, its The AMERICAN woman extending part of her culture to her friend.
Its that simple!!!!.
dont we celebrate birthdays in The Gambia (ex Yoro Bawol) and sing HB2U!!!!!! is it gambian??? perhaps a Cool Aid will lighten you up.
Well if we dont have baby shower the Americans do. Is it not out of line that an American is asking what she should do even though its part of her way of life. We dont have to preach to the choir.
The problem is that may be the Gambian friend did not explain to her that there is no babyshower in the Gambia.
By not coming out of the closet, Debra is innocently trying to find out what obtains in the Gambia when we do not have it in the first place. This is a simple case. Its an American culture and is better equipped to deal with it than her friend whose culture does not embrace babay shower.
When i was in College, a Gambian who attended a similar college before me used to eat pork even though he was a muslim and said islam had nothing to do with that. Its ok for muslims to eat.
When i was offered bacon i refused because islam was gainst it. The professor never hesitated to tell me the name of the Gambian muslim who ate pork and said it was ok.
This is the danger here and that is why we are all confused. Honesty is the key. Like my grand father said, if tell lies, no matter how hard you try tocover your tracks someone will know the truth.
Ask every Gambian lady, they still keep the list of names of those at their baby's babyshower even if it was five years ago, and will not donate until they make a rerefence to this list.
In Islam we are told that when you give a gift with your right hand, it should so secretive that the left hand should not know about it.
I am out of this please. The question is what Gambians normally do and the answer is Gambians do not it in the first place. |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Nov 2006 : 22:58:56
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quote:
Originally posted by debra
Thank you verymuch. It is very interesting to learn about each others cultures. Gambians are a very kind and thoughtful people. quote:
Originally posted by dbaldeh
Thanks Njucks, I think thought sometimes it is necessary to ask the question WHY things are done so we have an understanding how they came about in the first place.
This is the mistake you are making. There is no Gambian culture that has babyshower. From Kartong to Koina. Those who are seemingly trying to think it exist are not being honest to themselves. |
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LEMON TIME
Afghanistan
1295 Posts |
Posted - 10 Nov 2006 : 03:58:51
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| Kon You are very "DANGAM" WAGI EAH. |
There is no god but Allah |
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serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 10 Nov 2006 : 15:19:36
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quote:
Originally posted by gambiabev
A baby shower is an american idea, not a european one. Once again it is pure commerce, trying to get people to buy more stuff!
Personally I prefer the english way of waiting till the baby is safe and sound and then individually, quietly visiting the new family and taking a small personal present. But that is just me, as I have said before I am very english and dont like the brashness of many American ways!
Then I must be very english too, because for me it is tasteless to bring presents before the baby is born. But - sorry Debra, I don't mean you personally - taste and restraint have never been American virtues, least of all in business...
But, kondorong, giving presents at the naming ceremony is common; my little niece (she will be 1 year at the end of November) got so many clothes that my sister-in-law didn't have to buy one single piece until now. |
Edited by - serenata on 10 Nov 2006 15:37:09 |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 10 Nov 2006 : 19:02:56
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quote:
Originally posted by LEMON TIME
Kon You are very "DANGAM" WAGI EAH.
DANGAM is wollof and means being just recalcitrant and not giving up. The issue is unless i am not on bantaba, i will not stand by and see people say things that are not true of gambian culture.
When i first heard of babayshower, i thought they were going to give a bath to the baby. People are now renting a hall for the baby shower where women gather bringing gifts. Its too commercialised and no cultural taste. Americans dont rent a hall for babyshower but gambains do. many cook big bowls of food and some end up in th garbage. I HATE WASTE PERIOD. |
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anna
Netherlands
730 Posts |
Posted - 10 Nov 2006 : 23:47:01
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Even though you are a recalcitrant old man (or so you try very hard to make us believe), i now agree with you totally. Naming ceremonies often turn out to be 'statussymbols'. My partner told me some families spend so much on food, drinks, clothes etc. for the naming ceremony of their child, that after the party they are (as he calls it) 'totally skinny'. I heard of naming ceremonies costing the parents around 30,000 dalasis, and i am talking about ordinary families.
Maybe this is not cultural (and maybe it is off-topic too) but would you say that it is a Gambian characteristic to want to 'show off'? There sometimes seem to be tremendous pressure to make others believe you are better off than you are in reality.
In my (Dutch, and so economical) view, 25,000 out of the 30,000 would better be spent on the baby's future education - and with the rest you can still offer your friends and family a nice big benachin to celebrate the birth. |
When an old African dies, it is as if a whole library has burnt down.
Amadou Hampate Ba (Mali) |
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