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kaanibaa
United Kingdom
1169 Posts |
 Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 13:42:59
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May be you can tell us who is bad , for indeed the saying is true that "who feels it knows it" . I felt badly treated so I say Yahya Jammeh is bad period ! May be he was good for you so you can say he is good or the best ; which leaves us all in the merry go round cycle of two legs bad four legs good only for it to be revised to four legs bad two legs good eh!I am afraid that it is not as simple as that for the factors that show or indicate satisfaction of the ruled about how they are being ruled requires a lot of gauges which include among others their freedom of choice of leaders in a free fair election etc, which is surely absent in The Gambia.
The ground is not a level playing field so the incumbent has all the unfair advantage plus the use of force , threats and detentions under the guise of bogus acts of parliament they chose to call laws of the land to ensure that he stays in the pole position. This is what you call a legitimate ruler .
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
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toubab1020
12311 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 16:13:39
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Turk, I know that you love discussion and are quite happy to go with any view that is contra to that posted,that's your way of doing things to keep discussion alive, but really your posting here defies logic,you throw into the mix complication after complication i,e which leader is bad in some instances and the same leader good in other circumstances,OK going on from that I have just written let me say it depends on the time and circumstances as to the badness or otherwise of a particular leader,after all it's all about politics and greed in one form or another.I am not going along any of the branch lines of the railway that you have added.
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Originally posted by turk
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I would say that in MOST cases if leadership is BAD then the people would welcome intervention.
Touby, we have a problem, who decides when leadership is 'BAD'. Please enlighten me the criteria. I mean Saddam was hero when he was fighting with Iran and no intervention, but he is bad when he speak up against Israel and they invaded iraq to bring him down. Mubarak was not bad, and USA supported him, until they realize he is a goner? Osama Bin Ladin was hero when he was against Soviet Empire, then he became devil. Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, UAE, Qatar, Bahrain kingdoms are great but Libya is bad. Who are "BAD" and what define "BAD"?
What is BAD?
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"Simple is good" & I strongly dislike politics. You cannot defend the indefensible.
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 16:40:38
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| Well, the criteria for the badness of political leadership is subjective. But one thing I am certain which is my argument. Decision and action must be taken by the nation itself. Former colonial master is not qualified and should not be let to involve. There is nothing wrong with go merry around. That is the process and nation must go through the painful process which is the natural course of national building. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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toubab1020
12311 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 18:28:09
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What you forget Turk is that THE LEADERS are the ones with the MONEY and POWER,which lets THEM have access to WEAPONS and other items of "defence" obtainable from industrialised countries ,probably "former colonial masters".
THE PEOPLE on the other hand do not have MONEY because THE LEADERS have the MONEY,therefore THE PEOPLE in MOST cases cannot bring about change,so intervention by FOREIGN countries is inevitable,for change to take place. Simple Really. |
"Simple is good" & I strongly dislike politics. You cannot defend the indefensible.
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Edited by - toubab1020 on 17 Apr 2011 18:30:40 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 18:57:49
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| Touby - So, are you saying intervention by former colonial powers is justified? |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 20:06:33
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quote:
Originally posted by toubab1020
What you forget Turk is that THE LEADERS are the ones with the MONEY and POWER,which lets THEM have access to WEAPONS and other items of "defence" obtainable from industrialised countries ,probably "former colonial masters".
THE PEOPLE on the other hand do not have MONEY because THE LEADERS have the MONEY,therefore THE PEOPLE in MOST cases cannot bring about change,so intervention by FOREIGN countries is inevitable,for change to take place. Simple Really.
Solid fact, Toubab1020, in the simplest and best expression.
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Karamba |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 20:26:23
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| Perfect logic for cowards who can't fight. There are warriors who can die for their people and families. There are cowards who beg help from others including former enemies and hide in the bush. People get the government they deserve. People get the colonial master they deserve. It is simple. I watched this movie again and again. Why don't people stand up for themselves instead of waiting 'righteousnesses foreign hero' to come rescue. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 17 Apr 2011 20:27:11 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 20:50:47
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".....Perfect logic for cowards who can't fight......" Turk
Hey, Turkie, Gambians are not barbaric fighters as your narrow vision perceives. We will never be compelled to fight as we get rid of the monster. If you blink about seeing blood flowing on Gambian streets, think properly.
Deception and contempt will not score on decent Gambians. We know what we want and will have things our way without a drop of blood as you wish to see. Keep dreaming. |
Karamba |
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toubab1020
12311 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 20:56:55
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"Why don't people stand up for themselves instead of waiting 'righteousnesses foreign hero' to come rescue."
Turk I have told you before:
NO MONEY
Besides Not Everyone wants to die for their cause .
quote:
Originally posted by turk
Perfect logic for cowards who can't fight. There are warriors who can die for their people and families. There are cowards who beg help from others including former enemies and hide in the bush. People get the government they deserve. People get the colonial master they deserve. It is simple. I watched this movie again and again. Why don't people stand up for themselves instead of waiting 'righteousnesses foreign hero' to come rescue.
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"Simple is good" & I strongly dislike politics. You cannot defend the indefensible.
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Edited by - toubab1020 on 17 Apr 2011 20:59:39 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 22:36:04
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Karamba
Barbaric fighters!!!!!!! As long as people like you exist, African will fail. The mentality of yours is the one of the main obstacle for success. People will not respect cowards like you.
I never wish any violence in Gambia and I don't want any of my Gambian family to get hurt. However, if necessary, defending myself and standing up for my people and family is not barbaric in my book. I would die for my family and if necessary I would kill. If you call me barbaric for this. I have no problem with it. Everyone one has choice in their life.
The difference between the dude in Tienanmen Square standing up in front of Chinese army and you is big difference. Unlike you, he did not beg someone else to fight for himself. Fight is not necessarily to spill blood. Mandela spent his most of his life in the prison. He was a fighter, unlike you running away from his country. Are you saying a fighter like Mandela is barbaric.
There are 'legends' 'heros' like Mandela, Malcolm X to inspire others. These are good stories. These are success stories. People like you do not have good stories. Because you are not capable. And there are cowards like you, people learn what not to do.
Malcolm X: 'Any means necessary'. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 17 Apr 2011 23:13:25 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2011 : 23:15:44
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Turk,
You stand tallest as the most deluded speculator. You are full of contradictions and the facts speak volumes on that. You have no clue about people and what they do. Yet, you bite your teeth to grind this junk of rubbish seeking to be taken serious.
Barbaric, please read the lines again and again. The statement is clear enough. Gambians are not barbaric. Does that mean you are, certainly not my words.
I am ceratin that Gambians in large numbers remain peaceful and will never settle on violent scores.
You are fond of reading your mind and seeking to twist people's words. If you choose to advocate violence, that's up to you. |
Karamba |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 00:52:12
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Karamba
Who advocates violence? Me? I just want one to be a man and stand up for self, family and community. I clearly indicated, Gambians need not need any violence. They should focus on development, keeping peace and progress. You are the one charging the current president with murder, drug dealing, rape and pedophilia. You are the one calling international forces to intervene. I am against any kind of uprising. It is not necessary for Gambia. I wish there was alternative opposition, but when I look at the opposition like UDP who are complete imbecile, I think it is better to keep Jammeh. However, based on your charges, smear campaign, baseless accusation, if there are these conditions, hypothetically, I am telling coward people like you, instead of begging others to use any means to rescue your family/communty/people, you stand up for yourself. I thought it is simple. But I realize it is too difficult to admit your short comings. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 18 Apr 2011 01:46:06 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 01:51:37
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Turkie, Gambians do not need your advice. You can stick to your belief and save the advice. Gambians know what they want and will pursue it decent and peaceful. Keep your side.
Violence no violence, that's up to you. What I can say on behalf of more than million Gambians is that people of that country are peaceful. It is such state of peace that a criminal like Yaya Jammeh is abusing. He knows that Gambians are not in the ugly business of taking up arms. So he took arms and continues to play the rule of violence and lawlessness. If Gambians were as barbaric as Yaya Jammeh, people would have used guns to dislodge his brutal reign of terror. True to the fine nature of Gambians, we don't know guns.
By occasion of the ruthless reign of brutality imposed by Yaya Jammeh, where a third party intervenes to dislodge the violent gun man, that is the fairest deal.
Gambians are not gun bearers and therefore will not heed to your lousy call for whatever stance. We believe in peace and will employ every possible peaceful means to rid off the tyrant.
http://hellogambia.com/?p=8573 |
Karamba |
Edited by - Karamba on 18 Apr 2011 02:14:35 |
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 02:36:21
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| Gambians surely know what they want. They elected Jammeh with 60 percent vote. I totally agree. They are not calling foreign intervention. My advise meant for you and your kind. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
Edited by - turk on 18 Apr 2011 02:42:51 |
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