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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 03:00:02
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Greeting Everyone,
"What´s wrong with English? Don´t you want to be a part of the World where everybody can understand you?"
Babylon this is a simplistic view point because English was not chosen by the world to be the major international language but was imposed on the world by conquest.And I do think this is the major crux of the problem for the world as far as conserving other languages and specifically African languages.
Yes, I do understand the point you are making and agree with it on a certain level that English allows people from all over the world to converse with each other and share knowledge. Out of the imposition of alien European languages being imposed on the Developing world today its has the advantage of colonised minds being able to get a more complete picture of the illusions spread by colonialism hence this debate.
Zooming in on African the dominance of Official European languages in Africa has been at the expense of mother tongue languages and with it also comes the dilution of culture. As language is an intregal part of culture it is important for African languages to be useful, to evolve and survive. It is a misconception and an arrogant narrow minded statement to preceive someone who is unable speak a European langauage as being stupid.
In England especially within the inner cities there are comprehensive translation networks for minority languages as part of the Equal Opportunities Act, and obviously those who cannot speak English are at a disadvantage in society if they cannot speak English but it is nevertheless shallow to preceive them as stupid.
On the point of tribalism and the Rwanda geneocide situation the situation between the Hutus and Tutu's was manipulated by both internal and external factors. Although on the surface it was the stereotypical African story of tribalism. Many African problems have been manipulated by the imposition of the false geography of Africa drawn up by the Berlin Conferences scramble for Africa. These artificial borders drawn up by the West, to satisfy there unquenchable thirst for greed and power. Obviously didn't exempt the vices of African collaborators who armed with guns and ammunition helped to fuel this common human trait. However the velocity of these tribal wars were sponsored by Europeans who traded these arms enabling dominant African tribes to instigate wars which in turn would provide victorious kings and chiefs with land, slaves and other resources. These human and physical resources were traded between Africans, Arabs, and Europeans of a specific class which we could term as the establishment. So yes Babylon human beings have a lot in common be it positive or negative.
Zooming in on language it is a gifted person who can speak two, three, four, five languages fluently and in Africa this is not uncommon. Whereas in Europe this is rare. For every language a person can speak gives them another view of the world to look at. There is a richness in being able to do this. In the west a linguist student of this callibah would be considered a genius with at least a PHD. Whereas in Africa this person might be a primary school drop out, and has had to learn these languages out of necessity.
If a African child could have access to studying in its mother tongue say with bilingual or trilingual books then it would fair much better than having to learn a completely foreign language with no real enforcement at home, if it comes from an illiterate family who didn't have the opportunity to receive an education. To simplify it what we are talking about is an appropriate education for nation building of Africa and not brain draining for the imperialist west.
Peace
Sister Omega.
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Peace
Sister Omega |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 14:24:45
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Hi Sister Omega!
So are you saying that the tribal conflicts in Africa is basically the wests fault because of drawing the borders for each of Africas countries? Where there no tribal conflicts before that? Why are there non stop, ongoing civil wars in Africa? Is it because of the former colonials or is it because people just don´t get along with eachother due to language and communication problems, or is it poverty that causes it? Are there are any simple answers or solutions for the crisis in Africa? Is the answer to peace between the people that the west widraws and leaves Africa totally to it´s own destiny, thinking they can gain total independence that way? Which country in this world is totally independent, aren´t all countries dependend on for example import and export to other countries (except maybe Norway) to keep the economic wheel spinning? We need eachother to survive as a nation. I have so many questions that I could sit here the whole day and write them down and I do not expect you to answer all quetions either. Some questions makes sense some don´t.
True it is that ones native language is important for the development of ones personality. Every child should have the right to learn the language that is spoken at home. That makes a person grow strong with steady roots to stand on for the rest of their life, also when you are secure in your mother tongue you can learn another, foreign language easier with more success. I am also making sure that my children gets a chance to know my native language and also their fathers language (wolof) because I know it is important for their personalities so that they will be able to grow up into strong individuals proud of both of their cultures. I believe it is extra important for biracial children to know both of their cultures and not just one part of it. It is my duty as a parent to make sure of that.
Also I wasn´t saying that people who can´t speak English are stupid, I never make that hasted judgements of people which would make Me look ignorant. I was just saying that, in reality -in the real life, you do need to be able to communicate in English if you leave your own country and in the business world. And I know that especially in the US people do make quick judgements of you if you don´t speak "proper" English = american english. There you get stares from ppl pretty fast if you even have a small foreign accent. That is why I said I would sure look funny if I went there and spoke Swedish, just as an example. I know that people are not stupid just because they do not speak a foreign language correct. But, unfortunately, far from all know that. |
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 17:47:36
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Hi Babylon for thousands of years African managed to take care of their own business without western interference and managed to create their own societies. It was in fact the westerners who took a quantum leap in their own development when they managed to gain access to the African trade routes. So Africans are capable of being isolationist if we put our mind to minding our own business, and we were the explorers as well because the trade wind have always blown at sea, so as long as there were boats humans could sail.
On the point of mother tongue development and adopting a series of official languages to be spoken in the African Union then I don't see this as being unattainable once certain external distractions allow Africans to focus on nation building. For at the moment Africa is spilt up into 6 zones five being in the continent and the 6th representing the African Diaspora. Therefore the most common languages spoken in each zone would be represented as official African Langauages. There is nothing new about this in prehistory Africans had traded with each other before European Expansion and long before the Roman Emperor African civilization. After all African history didn't start with the Portugese explorers.
English is my mother tongue and I am acutely aware of the fact my original language was taken away from me, although I have an English accent and leave in an English environment that does not make me English. i therefore see the anomally of the advantages and disadvantages of being in the Anglophone, and also have empathy who those who want to their mother tongues to survive in a functional capacity.
Babylon I agree with you that its important for transracial children to be exposed to both their cultures or more for a sense of wholeness. That is very important, again their are disadvantages for trans racial or transcultural children to be fluent in their families languages. If their mothers aren't fluent in their father's language unless they spend time amongst his family or community or reside in the country of his birth. I empathise his because language is normally transferred from mother to child hence the term mother tongue.
Peace
Sister Omega
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Peace
Sister Omega |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2005 : 02:09:52
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I do see now that the idea of having the six most common languages spoken from the six different zones represented as official languages is a very good idea. Yes indeed, that is infact a very brilliant idea that has my full support from this day on. Why not bring back and renew the system that was in Africa before the colonialism? That could make a huge positive difference. But how to make this thought into action?
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2005 : 11:28:24
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“Education for nation building” not nation fleeing
Encouraging a multilingual school system would not only be a deterrent to Brain Draining but would also turn the focus of education inwards. It would give the pupils a good sense of reality, strengthened self image and a holistic world view.
In Sweden kids from homes with other languages than Swedish are entitle to lessons in their home language (Mandingka, Wolof ect) within the school curriculum. The idea is; to encourage bilingualism with the notion that being confident and able in ones home language makes it easy to learn other languages.
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Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2005 : 20:31:56
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Hi janko, I commend the Swedish holistic Development education model that you referred to. There seems to be more enlightenment in non imperialist European countries i.e Norway and Sweden when in comes tolerance of embracing cultural diversity. Than Britain and France when it comes to minority Groups within their education systems. Swedish children from Ethnic minorities will have a better headstart compared to British children from the same ethnic groups who don't have the support throughout the school day as their Swedish counterparts have.
This model is one that needs to be emulated in the inner city areas of Britain where the educational model of common culture has failed non English mother tongue children, and the same applies to the lack of other African and Ethnic cultural input within the education system.
Because the British Education system is based on "common culture" which fundamentally means white European culture. Hence the lack of achievement amongst African students who face social exclusion as a consequence dillusionment due to a lack of continued
cultural input within the national school curriculum which needs to be seriously addressed to give children a positive image of themselves and what they are capable of achieve. Remembering the proverb of " a tree without roots."
Peace
Sister Omega |
Peace
Sister Omega |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2005 : 14:57:47
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As an English person visiting Gambia I see the fact that english is spoken in school as a really positive unifying force for the Gambia. That doesnt mean to say that the mother language shouldnt be valued and the mother culture too. BUT it is a fact of life these days (especially in the age of the internet) that you are giving children an incredible advantage if they can speak english in the world.
Most Gambians I meet speak several languages fluently. I am ashamed to say that I only speak english with a TINY amount of french. I am trying to speak a little of Mandinka....but I am not very good at languages.
Americanisation is a different thing. In England i dislike how our society is becoming more american and Africa should respect its history and culture and resist becoming another state of america!!!
American society isnt flawless and attractive. It is greedy and lonely. African society has SO many positives compared with America. |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2005 : 15:41:15
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| I was in the bookstore the other day trying to find any African fairytale books as Christmas gifts for my children, but couldn´t find a single one. Does anyone know any African authors who writes childrens books? |
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Momodou
Denmark
11835 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2005 : 16:23:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Babylon
I was in the bookstore the other day trying to find any African fairytale books as Christmas gifts for my children, but couldn´t find a single one. Does anyone know any African authors who writes childrens books?
There is a childrens book by N'denian Kebba Landing Sonko from Pakalinding. The book is in Swedish called "Sagoberättarens Barn". The book is a collection of folk tales from the Gambia and comes with a CD with all the songs in the stories. Its produced by Studiefrämjandet i Stockholm. Tel. nr. 08- 4415200 (ISBN 91-973511-0-5). I think you should be able to find the book in bookshops in Sweden. You could do a search for the book on the Internet if you cant find it in your local book store.
The African Writers Series also have many other books from all over Africa. You can visit the website here: http://www.heinemann.co.uk/secondary/series/index.aspx?n=541&s=671&skey=2013&d=s |
A clear conscience fears no accusation - proverb from Sierra Leone |
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kiwi
Sweden
662 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2005 : 16:54:26
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| Kebba Sonko is also author of "Djungelpojkens berättelser". The books and CD:s ought to be found at "Burkina Faso Boutique" at Gamla Stan, just opposite Storkyrkan |
kiwi |
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2005 : 18:57:42
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Thank´s alot Momodou and Kiwi, I´ll go find Kebba Sonko´s books first thing tomorrow morning!  |
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Momodou
Denmark
11835 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jan 2006 : 12:53:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Babylon
Thank´s alot Momodou and Kiwi, I´ll go find Kebba Sonko´s books first thing tomorrow morning!
Babylon, Did you get Kebba Sonko's books? In fact, he wrote four books and produced 5 CDs and I have all of them for my children.
Kebbe can be contacted at: 070 392 06 47 e-mail: kebba_sonko@swipnet.se |
A clear conscience fears no accusation - proverb from Sierra Leone |
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twinkly
United Kingdom
190 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jan 2006 : 15:55:43
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Hi All
Gambiabev wrote:
"As an English person visiting Gambia I see the fact that english is spoken in school as a really positive unifying force for the Gambia. That doesnt mean to say that the mother language shouldnt be valued and the mother culture too. BUT it is a fact of life these days (especially in the age of the internet) that you are giving children an incredible advantage if they can speak english in the world."
Gambiabev, I do see your point BUT I don't agree with you.
Of course it is an advantage to be able to speak English, but why does the whole curriculum and teaching have to be in English?I now live in the UK but I am from Central Europe, so English is not my mothertongue. We have learnt English in the last few years in school, and yes, it does open up doors as it is an international language but why should Africa have to give up their languages, just because we have to force through our education system there.It must take up a lot of time to learn english first, before the curriculum can be taught.In Gambia, I would love to see schools where teachers could teach in their own language and give English as a second language(as a subject).Of course there would have to be different schools for different languages but look how many different schools and settings we have in Europe........
I can't imagine coming to school for the first time and everything is taught in a foreign language, it would take me time to learn that language first before I can even start with school matters.
i know, I know, easier said than done.But I think the way to solve Problmes in Africa is not by forcing our western ways onto them, but to support them in what they feel is right for them.Many Westerners don't really have a clue about the (real)culture in Gambia so why should ppl like this decide what is best for them.
Sis Omega wrote:
"for thousands of years African managed to take care of their own business without western interference and managed to create their own societies."
You have many good points in your replies sis, I have great respect for you
Things like this should be said every day because white people don't realise that the world existed before the white man came and "discovered" the whole world
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Babylon
Sweden
691 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jan 2006 : 17:38:28
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  I couldn´t have said it better Twinkly. Wellsaid! And Momodou, I did manage to find one book named "Sagoberättarens barn" and what a great book indeed! my kids likes it alot (me too ). I´m going to buy all of Kebba Sonkos books.
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jan 2006 : 18:24:09
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Then in Gambia would you have separate schools for separate tribes speaking different languages? Segregation breeds ignorance of each other and problems for society. Look at the history of Northern Ireland.
The great strength of the Gambia is that people get along together very well. I think this is largely due to being schooled together. Segregation is a backward step. |
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twinkly
United Kingdom
190 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jan 2006 : 18:38:00
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 A very very good point actually, I have to think about that again |
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