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Nyarikangbanna
United Kingdom
1382 Posts |
 Posted - 29 Apr 2011 : 21:24:46
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Allez! That says it all, Rene. They don't want a coalition; they are merely pretending to want one.
We must do things our seperate ways then if pDOIS will not subscribe to universal principles of coalition building as known in the world we live in. And I hope you are not going to talk to me about Agenda 1444.
''Every man for himself; God for us all''
Thanks |
I do not oppose unity but I oppose dumb union. |
Edited by - Nyarikangbanna on 29 Apr 2011 21:26:21 |
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sankalanka
270 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 05:51:04
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Allez! That says it all, Rene. They don't want a coalition; they are merely pretending to want one.
We must do things our seperate ways then if pDOIS will not subscribe to universal principles of coalition building as known in the world we live in. And I hope you are not going to talk to me about Agenda 1444.
''Every man for himself; God for us all''
Nyari, this presidential election is not the end of the world. The problem is you guys are living just for this moment; while others are living to build the momentum that will lead eventually to the coming into being of the third republic.
Those who understand history and its dialectics; those who understand evolutionary processes and their contradictions, are a patience people. They are able to study and understand, interpret and relate to all these phenomena that creates its own path to social and political rejuvenation.
I think you are grossly unfair to PDOIS if your surmise their position with respect to this coalition, in the way and manner that you did. And to put the record straight, we will be going over the same arguments and counter arguments all over again. I do not see any merit in doing so.
For the last time, let us just agree to disagree.
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turk
USA
3356 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 06:01:42
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quote:
The problem is you guys are living just for this moment; while others are living to build the momentum that will lead eventually to the coming into being of the third republic.
Those who understand history and its dialectics; those who understand evolutionary processes and their contradictions, are a patience people. They are able to study and understand, interpret and relate to all these phenomena that creates its own path to social and political rejuvenation.
Yeah, I have been saying this but my nick is 'turk'. |
diaspora! Too many Chiefs and Very Few Indians.
Halifa Salah: PDOIS is however realistic. It is fully aware that the Gambian voters are yet to reach a level of political consciousness that they rely on to vote on the basis of Principles, policies and programmes and practices. |
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Janko
Gambia
1267 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 11:38:52
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"...Those who understand history and its dialectics; those who understand evolutionary processes and their contradictions, are a patience people..."
Please, help me understand the above, let those who know, enlighten us that do not know, thanks |
Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy |
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Nyarikangbanna
United Kingdom
1382 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 12:16:09
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Rene, I understand.You couldn't put it any better. It means PDOIS is ok with another five years of tyranny under Jammeh and as a result, they are not interested in an all inclusive coalition to confront Jammeh in the 2011 presidential election. My problem with that is; why are they pretending?
Anyway, every man for himself; God for us all.
Cheers |
I do not oppose unity but I oppose dumb union. |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 13:55:27
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IF NADD WAS NOT ESTABLISHED AS "AN ALL INCLUSIVE COALITION", A "GRAND COALITION" AND "NATIONAL ALLIANCE" FOR A NATIONAL CAUSE; YOU MUST BE JOKING AND PLAYING WITH TREASON 
PDOIS ALWAYS TENDER SOUND RESOLUTIONS, A COMPLETE STRATEGY, OPEN OPTIONS AND TACTICS TO CONFRONT JAMMEH AND APRC THROUGH THE POLLS. THEY WILL NEVER RELENT TO SENSITIZE EVERY CITIZEN ON WHAT IT TAKES TO CHART OWN DESTINY |
Edited by - kobo on 30 Apr 2011 14:16:31 |
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sankalanka
270 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 14:12:40
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"...Those who understand history and its dialectics; those who understand evolutionary processes and their contradictions, are a patience people..."
Please, help me understand the above, let those who know, enlighten us that do not know, thanks
Clean your house before pointing a finger ... Never be moved by delirious Well-wishers in their ecstasy
Janko, to change the destiny of a nation is not an easy task. It starts with imperceptible steps and ends with giant leaps.
Take the ANC of South Africa as an example. The ANC was established in 1912. It took almost a century for it to be triumphant.
Development in matters associated with political organizations is an evolutionary process. Quantitative changes evolve into qualitative changes. It is the seemingly imperceptible steps which graduated into the perceptible qualitative changes. Only those who understand these processes can stick it out to the end.
These are the people to rely on to build the foundation for an invincible political organization. Take the example of PDOIS. It has around for almost 30 years, and it is still relevant and viable.
Take the UDP as an example. It is presume to be the biggest political party in the Gambia, but is finding it very difficult to put together a simple coalition because purportedly it cannot garner the support of PDOIS.
Without a strong foundation, a political party can be as big as the sky, but will come tumbling down. Where is the P.P.P.? Where is the N.C.P? |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 14:34:24
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Sankalanka the following is wrong assumption;
"Take the UDP as an example. It is presume to be the biggest political party in the Gambia, but is finding it very difficult to put together a simple coalition because purportedly it cannot garner the support of PDOIS. "
UDP IS NOT WILLING ON A GRAND COALITION = NADD STRATEGY AND UNDER "MERGER OF POLITICAL PARTIES"
ADVOCATING TO "SUBSCRIBE TO UNIVERSAL PRINCIPLES OF COALITION BUILDING" AND "PARTY-LED COALITION" ARE ALL FLAWED AND PUTTING UDP IN WEAK POSITIONS TO SELL ITS AGENDA; START ANY OFFER, BARGAINING, NEGOTIATIONS AND DEAL FOR A COALITION WITH OTHER MAINSTREAM POLITICAL PARTIES |
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Janyanfara
Tanzania
1350 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 14:53:35
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quote:
Originally posted by kobo
IF NADD WAS NOT ESTABLISHED AS "AN ALL INCLUSIVE COALITION", A "GRAND COALITION" AND "NATIONAL ALLIANCE" FOR A NATIONAL CAUSE; YOU MUST BE JOKING AND PLAYING WITH TREASON
PDOIS ALWAYS TENDER SOUND RESOLUTIONS, A COMPLETE STRATEGY, OPEN OPTIONS AND TACTICS TO CONFRONT JAMMEH AND APRC THROUGH THE POLLS. THEY WILL NEVER RELENT TO SENSITIZE EVERY CITIZEN ON WHAT IT TAKES TO CHART OWN DESTINY
And here you go again
NADD meniac. UDP would never join NADD .Kobo tell me if you have got hearing problems or you've got short vission and can't read.I made it big for you to see.
Now tell me you were talking about PDOIS STATEMENT ON REPUBLICAN DAY 24 APRIL.
What had happened? Oh maybe I did not read all that led to NADD/UDP.
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Nyarikangbanna
United Kingdom
1382 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 14:58:44
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'Take the UDP as an example. It is presume to be the biggest political party in the Gambia, but is finding it very difficult to put together a simple coalition because purportedly it cannot garner the support of PDOIS.'- rene
Rene, mark the word 'Presume'. Are you trying to contest the fact that UDP is the biggest opposition party in the Gambia? I won't be surpise as such a utopian remark can only come from an intransigent pdois circle. They will stop at nothing to propagate their arrogance and promote their irrational intransigence in this coalition debate.
As you have already admitted, PDOIS is ok with another five years of JAMMEH tyranny but is having difficulty in stating this to the Gambian people hence, their endless and hopeless subterfuges to cover-up their ' Jammeh is ok' agenda.
UDP is not finding it difficult to put together a coalition. What we are trying to achieve is what the people demanded; an all inclusive opposition. We felt it is our duty to lead the way in achieving this goal. However, we can only do so much as no one can force a coalition on any party. The Gambian people understands that.
Like I said before; every man for himself; God for us all.
Cheers
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I do not oppose unity but I oppose dumb union. |
Edited by - Nyarikangbanna on 30 Apr 2011 15:06:34 |
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sankalanka
270 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 17:16:54
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Sankalanka the following is wrong assumption;
"Take the UDP as an example. It is presume to be the biggest political party in the Gambia, but is finding it very difficult to put together a simple coalition because purportedly it cannot garner the support of PDOIS. "
UDP IS NOT WILLING ON A GRAND COALITION = NADD STRATEGY AND UNDER "MERGER OF POLITICAL PARTIES"
ADVOCATING TO "SUBSCRIBE TO UNIVERSAL PRINCIPLES OF COALITION BUILDING" AND "PARTY-LED COALITION" ARE ALL FLAWED AND PUTTING UDP IN WEAK POSITIONS TO SELL ITS AGENDA; START ANY OFFER, BARGAINING, NEGOTIATIONS AND DEAL FOR A COALITION WITH OTHER MAINSTREAM POLITICAL PARTIES
Kobo, your observation is valid, and I accept that my assumption as highlighted above is wrong.
You have been very good in bringing up evidences to corroborate that PDOIS is not the problem in this coalition effort, as Nyari would like us to believe.
Rather the concepts that Nyari is trying to sell is flawed and will not be bought. He has to come up with something better. |
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Nyarikangbanna
United Kingdom
1382 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 17:29:57
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UDP is bigger than NADD and therefore, it makes no sense whatsoever for us to join NADD. That proposition just doesn't make sense and it is part of a pdois intransigence to avoid being dragged into a coalition of parties based on universally recognised conventions and principles.
Rene, I am not interested in selling anything to pdois. I just want them to come plain and tell Gambians that they are ok with another five years of Jammeh's tyranny rather than pretending to be wanting the opposite.
Thanks |
I do not oppose unity but I oppose dumb union. |
Edited by - Nyarikangbanna on 30 Apr 2011 17:48:22 |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 17:50:15
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NADD IS STILL ALIVE, LEGALLY REGISTERED AND VIBRANT AS EVER NADD MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING IS AN OPEN BOOK PDOIS NEVER BETRAYED THOSE STAKEHOLDERS WHO CONCEIVED THE STRATEGY AND TACTICAL ALLIANCE OF ALL OPPOSITION PARTIES AGAINST JAMMEH/APRC IN 2006
COMPARE NADD WITH UDP/NRP OR UDP/GMC ALLIANCES AND THESE ARE FACTS BASED;
1. HOW DID THEY FORMED? = UNKNOWN OR "BACK-CORNER DEALS"
2. WHAT LEGAL DOCUMENT BINDS THEM? = UNKNOWN
3. WHAT TERMS WERE AGREED? = UNKNOWN
4. ARE UDP/NRP AND UDP/GMC ALLIANCES STILL EXISTING? = NO THEY ARE ALL DEFUNCT, ABOLISHED OR NON-EXISTENT NOW
IF THOSE ALLIANCES WERE STRONG, ANY SOBER PERSON WOULD WONDER WHY DID NRP AND GMC DESSERT UDP OR THE PURPORTED COALITION/ ALLIANCE ALREADY SOLD TO THEM
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Edited by - kobo on 30 Apr 2011 17:54:47 |
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sankalanka
270 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 18:56:33
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quote:
Take the UDP as an example. It is presume to be the biggest political party in the Gambia, but is finding it very difficult to put together a simple coalition because purportedly it cannot garner the support of PDOIS.'- rene
Rene, mark the word 'Presume'. Are you trying to contest the fact that UDP is the biggest opposition party in the Gambia? I won't be surpise as such a utopian remark can only come from an intransigent pdois circle. They will stop at nothing to propagate their arrogance and promote their irrational intransigence in this coalition debate.
As you have already admitted, PDOIS is ok with another five years of JAMMEH tyranny but is having difficulty in stating this to the Gambian people hence, their endless and hopeless subterfuges to cover-up their ' Jammeh is ok' agenda.
UDP is not finding it difficult to put together a coalition. What we are trying to achieve is what the people demanded; an all inclusive opposition. We felt it is our duty to lead the way in achieving this goal. However, we can only do so much as no one can force a coalition on any party. The Gambian people understands that.
Like I said before; every man for himself; God for us all.
Cheers
Nyari, I am also reading what you are writing on the Gambia-l. I certainly hope that this is not the position of the UDP party. Why you keep making these remarks over and over again, beats my imagination. Or does it?
Now this is the problem. All the opposition political parties in the Gambia have programs that they would like to implement if they take over the reins of power. They also have principles that would govern their conduct if they take over the government. They also have aims and objectives, and a mission.
Invariably all these things are unique to each opposition political party. This is the reason why the people have choices to pick among them.
If there is a desire for the opposition parties to come together to form a coalition, one of these options must happen:
1)A Merger- whereby all the opposition political parties come together and form an umbrella organization; in this instance NADD. They have a memorandum of understanding that will bind all the political parties; institute programs and structures that will govern such a merger, and form a transitional government. This option has failed due to the reason/s everybody is aware of.
2)A Coalition- whereby all the opposition political parties will retain their autonomy, and will agree amongst themselves the manner in which they can put all their resources together; the principles that will bind them all together; the institutions and structures that they will agree to build, and lastly the type of government they can agree to form.
They will put all these agreements and concessions in a memorandum of understanding, which will form the basis of any Government that they would put in place. This is the first point to note.
The second point to note is how the mechanics of building a coalition can be formulated.
Instead of one party inviting other parties to join it for a discussion, all parties would be invited to develop a concept paper on the type of coalition they want to form. These concept papers would then form the basis of the arguments, negotiations, concessions and agreements that will ultimately create the framework and structures for a coalition.
Merely telling people to come and join you in a party-led coalition is not going to cut it.
Nyari, you have to develop a concept paper and tell us the type of government you want to form under a party-led coalition. What are the institutions and structures your government will put in place, and how are these institutions and structures going to be different from what obtains presently. We need to know all these things.
If Lawyer Darboe becomes the coalition president and appoints you as a minister, we need to know about your portfolio so that we can hold you accountable. Especially given the level of disdain you then to treat people who disagree with you.
I can assure you that myself or any other PDOIS sympathizer are the least arrogant. We always strive to me humble.
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Janyanfara
Tanzania
1350 Posts |
Posted - 30 Apr 2011 : 20:57:43
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quote:
Originally posted by kobo
NADD IS STILL ALIVE, LEGALLY REGISTERED AND VIBRANT AS EVER NADD MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING IS AN OPEN BOOK PDOIS NEVER BETRAYED THOSE STAKEHOLDERS WHO CONCEIVED THE STRATEGY AND TACTICAL ALLIANCE OF ALL OPPOSITION PARTIES AGAINST JAMMEH/APRC IN 2006
COMPARE NADD WITH UDP/NRP OR UDP/GMC ALLIANCES AND THESE ARE FACTS BASED;
1. HOW DID THEY FORMED? = UNKNOWN OR "BACK-CORNER DEALS"
2. WHAT LEGAL DOCUMENT BINDS THEM? = UNKNOWN
3. WHAT TERMS WERE AGREED? = UNKNOWN
4. ARE UDP/NRP AND UDP/GMC ALLIANCES STILL EXISTING? = NO THEY ARE ALL DEFUNCT, ABOLISHED OR NON-EXISTENT NOW
IF THOSE ALLIANCES WERE STRONG, ANY SOBER PERSON WOULD WONDER WHY DID NRP AND GMC DESSERT UDP OR THE PURPORTED COALITION/ ALLIANCE ALREADY SOLD TO THEM
Kobo Jammeh,
ya NADD is there but comon we are not a member and vission 2011 is a non issue as far as we are concerned.
For your assertions that unregistered, unfound, unknown,
is a malicious lies and untruth allegations you know only what you know and you appear to be those I call people living in their own fools paradise.Gambian are no fools look do you expect mature political leaders to come to form an alliance without meeting of minds?
What do you know about KMC, NRP or UDP apart from what everybody knows?
How can you in little brain think you can lecture us as what we should do.
My friend Gambia belongs to all and anyone who think they can dictate their ideas on others without giving them the oppotunity to air out their views, must be living in a dead nation wher ony he/she is alive.
Those days are gone when few so called educated elites can come and bombard Gambian with few hyphaluting tgerminologies and people would shout without even knowing the meaning of those remarks.
There are thousands and thousands of Gambians with their doctrates today so we are no longer in want of intelectuals.People need to engage in dialouge and discussions so as to find a common ground for the Gambia and Gambians.
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